Counting On Season 2 - Part 5

[Jana814]

I'm not a kid person either. Last week their were 2 kids running around my house & I was not very happy about it.  

Saturday my first cousin & his family is suppose to come to our house. I really don't want them to.  I'm also sick so being around a kid is the last thing I want to deal with Saturday. 

[halcionne]

On 10/19/2016 at 7:16 AM, SassyPants said:

Jill was wearing a bridesmaid dress from Jessa's wedding in that ice cream shot.

Wonder if it was her dress? She was 3+ months PG @ Jessa's wedding. Unless she borrowed a dress from one of Ben's sisters, which I doubt...and the dress did not appear too large for Jill...and none of the Duggar girls is larger than Jill, when Jill was PG. Maybe Jill is PG- if the dress stretched to accommodate Jill's growing belly, and it's the same dress,  wouldn't it now hang?

Where are our Sherlock Holmes members???

I haven't seen the photo mentioned here, but I watched a bit of this week's episode and she looked pregnant to me when they were leaving Danger America:

Also. Is she shrinking, like Michelle? Jill came up to Derick's smile in their wedding photos. But she's not standing up straight here and maybe she wore heels at her wedding? So she's probably not shrinking, then. 

[JessaBlessa]

I thought she went barefoot at her wedding.

[Carm_88]

6 minutes ago, JessaBlessa said:

I thought she went barefoot at her wedding.

She did. It was a much argued point. 

[foreign fundie]

As another expat mum I can relate. I also had nothing like an army base to hide in. And with a baby you are limited. They need to take naps and sleep early at night. Without a babysit that just means you are indoors most of the time. 

Also, after a year you are still in the middle of culture shock. The deeper you get engaged, the more you realise the differences and feel a stranger. If you go home during this adjustment phase or get constant visitors, it could delay your acculturation. Only going through the pain of the loss of everything familiar will get you to the other side. Escaping does not help.

I would recommend staying in the new location 2-4 years (depending on the 'size' of the culture gap) before your first trip home. That will give you time to find a place in the new country where you are sufficiently comfortable that you can return again with confidence. (For those who plan to stay many years or even make the new country their permanent home)

By the way, as I have understood it ofrom the start, the Dillards are not 'on a mission' but have an open ended commitment as career missionaries. I fully expect they will go back. Even if Jill feels unhappy, that is to be expected and hopefully temporary. The only reason I could see for delay is a pregnancy. They are only just starting their work. If would be strange to give up now. 

Also, being abroad is a great chance for character development. If Jill and Derrick pull through the first few years of struggle, they may really grow in maturity and could gain a strong(er) bond as a couple. They may even have something interesting to say eventually.

[TheDuggarnaut]

I have a friend who was born and raised in El Salvador and she still experiences severe PTSD from things she experienced there. It's not a place I would take my children to. Just my personal opinion, but I don't think it's a wise choice.

[shesinsane]

The Duggar kids were naming the foods they would want when returning to America after being out of the country for a while. Joy said "Some kind of Italian food, like fettuccine, or spaghetti, lasagna," Wasn't it just last week's episode that the Duggar gals were all clueless about Italian food? In their talking heads when Jinger met Jeremy's Italian grandmother?

Jinger said "Probably one of the first things that I would want is salad. Over in Central America you can't have like, a lot of salad or like, fresh items? A lot of it has to be cooked or boiled just so that you won't get sick."  So the Duggars are aware fresh food exists elsewhere, but one of the dangers of Central America is the food. 

[apandaaries]

6 hours ago, CharlieInCharge said:

 

Second, I gotta defend the no fresh food thing. I lived in Asia for two years and drank bottled water the whole time. And fresh produce grown in contaminated soil can never be washed enough or good produce washed in contaminated water can never be 'clean' enough. I know you can theoretically adapt to those microbes, but I worked with a lot of ex-pats and they all did the same no matter how long they had lived there. 

<snip snip>

On a more cynical note, I can now see Jessa and Ben's contempt growing. They remind me of several couples I've know who ended up divorced. I don't think the strain of two under two is going to help matters. Those aunty-moms are going to be staying over at the tiny house a LOT.

Where did you live?  I lived in South Korea for a year and never had a problem.  I did know some people with issues, but vegetables, fruit, and water were fine.  Then again, it was South Korea, which has a lot of development.

I'm also curious to see what will happen with Bin and Blessa over the next few years.  She's been annoyed with him for awhile; pregnancy hormones and fatigue isn't about to help with that.  They say contempt is one of the worst qualities for a relationship, and Jessa....doesn't hold Bin in high regard.  There's an interesting study on the qualities of successful v. unsuccessful long term relationships: http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/06/happily-ever-after/372573/  Wonder what the future holds for them.  

[Carm_88]

2 hours ago, shesinsane said:

The Duggar kids were naming the foods they would want when returning to America after being out of the country for a while. Joy said "Some kind of Italian food, like fettuccine, or spaghetti, lasagna," Wasn't it just last week's episode that the Duggar gals were all clueless about Italian food? In their talking heads when Jinger met Jeremy's Italian grandmother?

Jinger said "Probably one of the first things that I would want is salad. Over in Central America you can't have like, a lot of salad or like, fresh items? A lot of it has to be cooked or boiled just so that you won't get sick."  So the Duggars are aware fresh food exists elsewhere, but one of the dangers of Central America is the food. 

I would imagine that the type of thing that the Duggars eat would be available to some extent in CA. It's not like they eat fresh fruit or veggies anyway.

[VeryNikeSeamstress]

On 10/19/2016 at 11:11 AM, amandaaries said:

ETA: the house looked pretty good when all was finished.  Too bad the Saintly Dillards don't seem particularly worried about picking up after themselves.  But why no toddler safety set-ups? No baby gates? 

That's because they need material for next season. This way they can devote an entire episode to babyproofing Casa de Dullards. Of course, about half the episode will feature flashbacks of babyproofing Chez Smugwald.

I'm jumping on the Jill is pregnant train too. She's probably not as along as she was during Jessa's wedding, so she chose that dress partly because it still fits loosely enough to downplay a bump.

[Bad Wolf]

That's a nice guest house. I could live there, except for Duggar proximity.

[JessaBlessa]

5 minutes ago, VeryNikeSeamstress said:

That's because they need material for next season. This way they can devote an entire episode to babyproofing Casa de Dullards. Of course, about half the episode will feature flashbacks of babyproofing Chez Smugwald.

I'm jumping on the Jill is pregnant train too. She's probably not as along as she was during Jessa's wedding, so she chose that dress partly because it still fits loosely enough to downplay a bump.

Going along with that theory, maybe Jill *has* heard her baby's heartbeat already, which is why she made that comment to Jessa.  My DVR recorded a little preview of next week's episode, and Jill and Derick make comments about how they can't believe that Jessa is having a second baby first.  They act like they have a secret.

[Bad Wolf]

@Buzzard Your recaps are so good, I keep thinking I've already watched the episode when I finally get around to it a few days later. Thank you. 

[CharlieInCharge]

1 hour ago, amandaaries said:

Where did you live?  I lived in South Korea for a year and never had a problem.  I did know some people with issues, but vegetables, fruit, and water were fine.  Then again, it was South Korea, which has a lot of development.

Snip 

I was in Taiwan, but in a fairly rural area. Even my friends in Taipei (Capital city) drank bottled water though, but this was about 7 years ago so it might be better now. 

[apandaaries]

3 minutes ago, CharlieInCharge said:

I was in Taiwan, but in a fairly rural area. Even my friends in Taipei (Capital city) drank bottled water though, but this was about 7 years ago so it might be better now. 

Really?  I was there 13+ years ago.  I drank a lot of bottled water, but never freaked out about tea or tap water.  I do have a strong stomach and I also was a vegetarian at the time (no fish, ideally), so perhaps that helped. While I lived in the city, I also traveled to rural areas, and didn't change my eating patterns as my locales changed.  Things were fine for me and many of my friends.  I did know of a few Westerners with issues, but they were always a small percentage of the overall group.  

[CharlieInCharge]

It was standard practice when I lived there, I honestly never questioned it because everyone around me did the same. We were working in a situation where time off for illness was not really allowed except in extreme cases. Maybe it was just a precaution, but I went with it and never got seriously ill. 

[apandaaries]

9 minutes ago, CharlieInCharge said:

It was standard practice when I lived there, I honestly never questioned it because everyone around me did the same. We were working in a situation where time off for illness was not really allowed except in extreme cases. Maybe it was just a precaution, but I went with it and never got seriously ill. 

Long-term illness was not really accepted nor tolerated where I was, either, but pharmacies were happy to dispense all kinds of things to help people overcome various issues (again, I knew folks with that issue, but it didn't plague me).  I also got to read what the US Army recommended for people living aboard, which included washing veggies in  a bleach solution.  Never did that, but I was okay, and many that I knew were fine.  But I did know a small percentage who had some issues adapting.  I would buy veggies and fruits from the local vendors, prepare them in various forms (including raw salads), eat them, and survive.  I'd expect something similar from Taipei expats, but I never made it over there to visit, so lack firsthand experience there. 

[Bad Wolf]

When we used to backpack, we took water purifying tablets with us, so we could use river or lake water. Could the Dillards have done that? They were back often enough and had plenty of visitors, so it would have been easy to keep a supply. We also boiled our water.

[CharlieInCharge]

2 minutes ago, amandaaries said:

Long-term illness was not really accepted nor tolerated where I was, either, but pharmacies were happy to dispense all kinds of things to help people overcome various issues (again, I knew folks with that issue, but it didn't plague me).  I also got to read what the US Army recommended for people living aboard, which included washing veggies in  a bleach solution.  Never did that, but I was okay, and many that I knew were fine.  But I did know a small percentage who had some issues adapting.  

I didn't have access to a pharmacy in my area (about 1 1/2 hours to large enough town) and I am definitely a soft-tummy when it comes to bugs, so probably all for the best. The bleach produce sounds a bit smelly, but effective. I live on a farm now and grow a lot of my own stuff and we tested the soil for lead first because I'm still a bit paranoid about soil contamination  

[eveandadam]

I just saw the episode and have to say that Ben and Jessa seem stuck. They are both victims of their parents I think. If they didn't have any children they could get a divorce and Ben could marry Joy in 5 years time :-), but, hélas, with 2 children, they stuck.

Jill has had a huge reality check in CA, not only concerning mission trips and safety (gangs, zika,...) but also in terms of intelligence and education. She may have realized that she is not as educated and intelligent as she thought she was, plus I think she was bored there. But still, I would say Jill and Derick have the best skills to survive in the real world. Derick as an accountant and Jill could do a real midwivery/nurse course at college. Please Jill, do that if you are dedicated and intelligent enough (I hope so)! But a nursing degree is like 4 years of college + 2 years of nursing school in the U.S., is that right? which  would be way more than in my country and, honestly, I would rather be treated by an american CN than by a nurse from my country. Idk, from Jill's perspective that could be too mcuh work with at least 1 little child at home. But I can see Jill being a CN if she overcomes her modesty standards and is not too modest to touch a male patient.

 

 

 

[evolutionbaby]

I don't think anything happened to Jill either and that she is just suffering from culture shock, plain and simple. Of course everything would be fine for the first few months there. She had Derick's mum at the beginning and her family came to visit twice so there were things to look forward to. But the last several months there it really sinks in where you are and what you're doing and the homesickness creeps in and it's harder to be "totally" cheerful. 

I think Jessa and Bin will be just fine. Bin is too dopey to have any real problem with Jessa and unfortunately, as he *ahem* "matures", I think he will just turn into a clone of JB who only views his wife as a brood mare and cares nothing for her personality beyond her service to him. Jessa is merely going through a "willful" phase, and once Bin has had enough or realizes he's being taken for a fool then they will turn to their parents for "marriage counselling", and Jessa will be counselled to be a more obedient, generous, and cheerful helpmeet to Bin. PROBLEM SOLVED.

On the other hand, it could be Jill and Derick headed for divorce a few years down the line. Even though I think there is more genuine love and affection between them, if Jill really continues to be unhappy/uncomfortable/isolated doing missionary work and Derick is steadfast about remaining I could see Derick with his wanderlust ways leaving Jill holding the bag as a single mum with a couple of kids. He may send some child support from time to time, or he might skip out entirely and there would be very little anyone could do about it if he wasn't even in the country. Not saying this is going to happen, as I think divorce is very unlikely for either couple, but hey, anything is possible.

[VelociRapture]

5 hours ago, eveandadam said:

I just saw the episode and have to say that Ben and Jessa seem stuck. They are both victims of their parents I think. If they didn't have any children they could get a divorce and Ben could marry Joy in 5 years time :-), but, hélas, with 2 children, they stuck.

Jill has had a huge reality check in CA, not only concerning mission trips and safety (gangs, zika,...) but also in terms of intelligence and education. She may have realized that she is not as educated and intelligent as she thought she was, plus I think she was bored there. But still, I would say Jill and Derick have the best skills to survive in the real world. Derick as an accountant and Jill could do a real midwivery/nurse course at college. Please Jill, do that if you are dedicated and intelligent enough (I hope so)! But a nursing degree is like 4 years of college + 2 years of nursing school in the U.S., is that right? which  would be way more than in my country and, honestly, I would rather be treated by an american CN than by a nurse from my country. Idk, from Jill's perspective that could be too mcuh work with at least 1 little child at home. But I can see Jill being a CN if she overcomes her modesty standards and is not too modest to touch a male patient.

 

 

 

Depends on the program. Many employers are pushing for Nurses to hold at least a Bachelor of Science in Nursing now - that's a normal four year program if you enter straight out of High School. There are other paths as well to becoming a RN, but that seems to be the most popular now - and there are other educational programs for other positions as well that may take more or less time. 

Meaning, if Jill was motivated enough and wanted to (which I doubt), she could probably find a legitimate educational program that would fit her lifestyle. She likely wouldn't be able to do the work she does now, but she would have at least gone through a solid educational program and (hopefully) would be better prepared for real life.

[OyToTheVey]

On 10/18/2016 at 8:41 PM, Mothership said:

Jana sounds so much like Michelle--the same baby voice.  Ugh!

 

and I hate parents who think sneaking out is a good idea.   Say good bye and that you'll be back.  If they're going to fuss, they're going to fuss (probably more when they realize you're a sneak).  Nothing like thinking it's better for your child to feel deserted  [end rant]

I used to teach a 2.5 year old that had severe attachment problems. PSA: PLEASE DON'T SNEAK OUT! It's much healthier for the child to cry it out when they see you go bye bye. Just give them a kiss, wave bye, blow a kiss, so they get into the routine and go out the door. This child would cling to any adult she saw. It was really bad. She was always afraid adults wouldn't be there if she even went to play in a different section of the room. 

[Timetostoplurking]

I never realized that birthin babies was a competitive sport until I started paying attention to fundies!    Lol

[Analytica49]

So, I was thinking about the younger Duggar girls--especially Jo-Hanna, Jennifer, and Jordyn. My excuse for thinking about them is that they showed up on the most recent "Counting On"--although I also feel embarrassed that any of these people manage to colonize my thoughts.

But it occurred to me that the four youngest girls (adding Josie) to the other three) are having a MUCH different upbringing than the five oldest girls. By the time Jana and Jill were Jennifer's age--let alone Hannie's age--they had already been engaged in helping to raise their younger sibs for several years. (I have an image of Joy-Anna, at what must have been no more than eight years, combing one of the little boy's hair and helping him into his clothes.)

The Lost Girls, I said to myself, are not being indoctrinated into the world of Sister-Momming the way their older sisters were.

But then I saw that Smug-essa had somehow corralled Hannie, Jenny, and Jordyn to help with the baby sitting of Israel. (As if Smug-essa and Bin are incapable of caring for two little boys at once.) And then it hit me: Hannie, Jenny, and Jordyn (and possibly Josie, though I haven't seen it yet) are going to be "trained" in their jender roles by being required to care for their nieces and nephews. The Dullards' and the Smugwalds' spawn will become their responsibilities, at least for much of the time.

Because after all, what else are girls good for?

I feel so sad, remembering that Hannie once said (she was maybe about six) that she wanted to be a doctor ....