• Sky
  • Blueberry
  • Slate
  • Blackcurrant
  • Watermelon
  • Strawberry
  • Orange
  • Banana
  • Apple
  • Emerald
  • Chocolate
  • Charcoal
samurai_sarah

John Shrader Pt 9- Zealous in Zambia

660 posts in this topic

I had to get a visitor's permit last time I was in Zambia (earlier this summer) because my permit was being appealed. It only let me stay 30 days so I had to go to the immigration office with our attorney's assistant and wait for a long time to get an extension. I had a highly educated Zambian woman with me who works regularly with immigration and the courts in Lusaka and still had to come back twice and jump through hoops. I am sure John would be completely taken advantage of in the immigration office. I shudder to think about him going in there alone and trying to get a visa/permit.

 The record keeping is so bad he can probably hide out and not be noticed (EDIT: Unless he is pulled over or stopped by the Police and they ask to see his documentation) but the problem will come if he tries to leave the country. They look closely at your visa when you exit and can give you big problems (either a large cash fine or detainment) if your paperwork is not in order. For most visitors this is not a problem but for those of us who spend a significant amount of time in the country it is. When I left the country this last time I had my visa paperwork, my rejection, my appeal, and my report order all with me and I was let through immigration. I don't think it would go as well for John.... 

Also, I fundraise 100% of my salary and am anal retentive about making sure my donors know what I am up to and the kind of investment they are making in my specific work. If he is less than honest with his donors then that is inexcusable. I am new to the conversation here so I am not very acquainted with John but had to add my 2 cents about how everything works (or most of the time doesn't) in Zambia. 

Edited by NikeKnees
18

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, NikeKnees said:

I had to get a visitor's permit last time I was in Zambia (earlier this summer) because my permit was being appealed. It only let me stay 30 days so I had to go to the immigration office with our attorney's assistant and wait for a long time to get an extension. I had a highly educated Zambian woman with me who works regularly with immigration and the courts in Lusaka and still had to come back twice and jump through hoops. I am sure John would be completely taken advantage of in the immigration office. I shudder to think about him going in there alone and trying to get a visa/permit.

 The record keeping is so bad he can probably hide out and not be noticed (EDIT: Unless he is pulled over or stopped by the Police and they ask to see his documentation) but the problem will come if he tries to leave the country. They look closely at your visa when you exit and can give you big problems (either a large cash fine or detainment) if your paperwork is not in order. For most visitors this is not a problem but for those of us who spend a significant amount of time in the country it is. When I left the country this last time I had my visa paperwork, my rejection, my appeal, and my report order all with me and I was let through immigration. I don't think it would go as well for John.... 

Also, I fundraise 100% of my salary and am anal retentive about making sure my donors know what I am up to and the kind of investment they are making in my specific work. If he is less than honest with his donors then that is inexcusable. I am new to the conversation here so I am not very acquainted with John but had to add my 2 cents about how everything works (or most of the time doesn't) in Zambia. 

I got back from spending 8 weeks there with an educational institution on an invitation of the government and this was the first time we had to renew our VISA every 30 days, it was a PITA. At least we had to go back to our point of entry to do it, which was a two day trip. We were warned if we did not renew it every 30 days we might get arrested when we left. We had not issues but we had our paperwork in order. Outside the Luska & Kafue the police would stop our vehicle to check our VISA paperwork to make sure we were in the country legally. We heard stories of missionaries without the correct paperwork being arrested and had to pay large fines to both the local police and government. Current government, which got re-elected is being held responsible of all the undocumented Chinese workers that are taking jobs from the locals. 

I agree that majority of strictly religious missionaries that go to developing world have no idea what they are doing and how to work within the guidelines of the country. One of PP's minion's is moving to Botswana to get married, start a church and do annoying for jesus this should be another train wreck. 

I have always wondered how John boy can afford all the internet time that he uses because it is very expensive. The problem with John boy is that he is well known in Kafue especially when he is driving the "truth mobile" he can't be missed. There are just too many holes in his stories.

By the way Nikesknees what do you do in Zambia?

 

8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, NikeKnees said:

<snip for space>

I am new to the conversation here so I am not very acquainted with John but had to add my 2 cents about how everything works (or most of the time doesn't) in Zambia. 

Thank you for all the information.

I probably do sound harsh about John Shrader but I've been watching him for 4+ years and, as a former missionary kid, he boggles my mind.  He is an Independent Fundamental Baptist (IFB) solo missionary, but he gives even them a bad name.  He is "Poisonwood Bible" type.

This is our 9th official thread on John and there are a few more before we started numbering them.   Probably his most egregious action so far was to buy a plane sight unseen for 15K - when he had no pilot's licence - for his flying ministry.  He avoids all mention of the plane these days because it is a pile of scrap metal and his US pilot's license is worthless in Zambia.  None of his donors seem to question him at all.

He is full of similar grandiose plans that come to nothing.  

4 minutes ago, countressrascal said:

I got back from spending 8 weeks there with an educational institution on an invitation of the government and this was the first time we had to renew our VISA every 30 days, it was a PITA.

It sounds as though they have changed the rules from the last time I looked at the requirements.

7 minutes ago, countressrascal said:

I agree that majority of strictly religious missionaries that go to developing world have no idea what they are doing and how to work within the guidelines of the country.

It isn't all missionaries by all means - some do very good work, are culturally educated and sensitive, and have efficient organizations behind them.  It is these unaffiliated, inefficient, arrogant, conversion-only bozos like John Shrader that drive me up the wall.

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@countressrascal Orphan care and education but specifically dance therapy. 

 

@Palimpsest Your Poisonwood Bible reference makes me sick to my stomach. The children I have worked with for the past 6 years are so close to me now they are like family. The ignorance with which some people operate is really hard to swallow. 

7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@NikeKnees and @countressrascal , thank you for all of the information you've been sharing.  since I've never lived outside the US, I have pretty much no idea how things work outside of maybe Canada, and I've learned quite a lot from your first-hand accounts.  I hope you'll be able to continue.  thanks again!

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't waste any tiny amount of sympathy on John. He is the world's worst missionary. His ex-mission pal David Rea is pretty much just as bad. @countressrascal, is Rea as well known as Shrader? From what I've read on his FB page is seems to be just as vile as John. 

6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well damn it, he got himsel some chickens. The men are expected to sell 400 chickens every three weeks. I'm not sure what the chicken industry is like in Zambia, but is that realistic? 

Quote

so the guys will only be selling 400 every three weeks instead of 800 every six!

There is no way John isn't going to skim some money out of the chicken profits. 

Edited by formergothardite
8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the first chicken video Johns sounds like himself.

In the third video, two and a half weeks later, some of the the guys are with him and he is back to speaking  in his ridiculous "local" accent. 

He still can't pronounce Kafue!

He really is a total twonk.

5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, formergothardite said:

I'm not sure what the chicken industry is like in Zambia,

I've been on Free Jinger about a year now, and I can safely say I never thought I'd be researching Zambian poultry at any point over the course of my entire life.   It looks like there is a fairly recent initiative in Kafue to regulate residential chicken farms as well as protect public health.  There are some statistical reports on-line, and I am not poultry savvy, but I found this article (I snipped this out of tiozambia.com) which shed some light on the local industry.  I do hope John is not flooding the market and adversely affecting the worried retirees (see bolded).  I am actually relieved to see the chicks in all their glory, as John said.
 

Quote

 

KAFUE District Council Secretary Aaron Kamalondo says the local authority in conjunction with the department of agriculture will embark on a programme to train poultry farmers on how to manage their birds.

Mr Kamalondo said this was aimed at empowering the farmers with skills and knowledge on the importance of adhering to the Public Health Act.

The Council Secretary said this when more than 50 poultry farmers stormed his office to seek clarification on the ban on rearing chickens in residential backyards.

He explained that the local authority had a duty to protect the community and provide an enabling environment for business to flourish in the district.

....

Mr Musanje said the poultry farmers, who are mostly retirees, earn their livelihood from chicken sales hence requested the local authority to exercise lenience.

 

tiozambia.com (partial article)

10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, CTRLZero said:

I've been on Free Jinger about a year now, and I can safely say I never thought I'd be researching Zambian poultry at any point over the course of my entire life.  

I think the majority of us probably never thought we would be thinking about Zambian poultry. :laughing-jumpingpurple: 

John is not one to stop to think about how his actions are going to impact others, so I too am worried that he might flood the market, It just seems like a lot of chickens to sell every three weeks. 

I suspect John will be sitting back in his safari outfit watching the men taking care of chickens, gloating about how much work he has done in Zambia and thinking about how the Zambians really needed a white man like him to come teach them to work. 

20

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, exactly.  To start a business, item number 1 is to have a business plan that includes knowing EXACTLY who will be buying your product and the size of the market for your product.  

Agree with posters upthread that John had not ONE thought for who he might be damaging by flooding the local market with chickens or baby chicks or whatever the hell he is selling. 

Also, in the facebook photos, the chicks are in an inside room with just a small window.  Is that healthy for the little chicks?

 

Edited by Howl
6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That room doesn't look like it will be big enough for the chicks as they develop into chickens.  If anyone has seen Food, Inc., they'll recall the dozens of dead chickens tossed out of the giant rooms, and those had air filters and ventilation systems.  They need more space.

John is going to flood the chicken market soon.  He's like the Walmart of missionaries: indifferent to the indigenous and their culture, and totally prepared to shut down local small businesses with his artificially low prices.  

His here-again-gone-again accent is also infuriating.  

10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was hoping his accent was terrible but its really not too bad. I use an accent when children don't understand me or if I am joking around with adults. Otherwise its just plain ol American English or vernacular. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, NikeKnees said:

I was hoping his accent was terrible but its really not too bad. I use an accent when children don't understand me or if I am joking around with adults. Otherwise its just plain ol American English or vernacular. 

Uh, if you ever personally meet me, please don't? Seriously, just don't.

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, NikeKnees said:

@samurai_sarah Sorry, did I offend you? 

Sorry, I was a bit harsher than intended. I'm ESL, but can tell an affected accent from a real one. My apologies. my temper got the better of me, and I'm sorry.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@samurai_sarah Oh, no problem. I just wanted clarification to avoid offense in the future. No hard feelings here! 

Like I said, I usually only  use an accent if children can't understand my American accent. OR in some instances when talking with a Zambian friend and saying the words with an American accent just sounds so dopey. You can't say the name of the Zambian football team, Chipolopolo, in an American accent and not sound like a complete idiot. 

 

EDIT: I also should have clarified that I don't just go up to random adults and speak in their native accent. That is definitely not what I meant. Friends. Good friends of many years. Not strangers. 

Edited by NikeKnees
11

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the videos were taken in a back room before they built the new chicken coop.

Well, isn't this the bestest.  Let's quote John on FJ before he wipes his FB of incriminating evidence yet again.  Screen shots might be better.

Quote

The Timothy House Self-Sustaining, Self-Supporting Chicken Raising Program

God has provided a beautiful large chicken house behind the Timothy House where the men are now raising chickens!

This is the first 300 chickens in the new house (Originally, the first chickens were raised in the back room of the house we were renting for the church! That's the house our family is now living in).

This is progress after less than three weeks (it will be three weeks on Friday).

We're all very excited, because now that the project is up and running, the men will soon be completely self-supporting, which is a key to our practical philosophy of ministry.

They are also gardening as well, raising vegetables for their food.

This chicken business gives them invaluable experience in learning practical "tent-making" business skills, learning how to run and manage a business, the confidence of supporting themselves instead of a dependency mindset, and even saving for the future.

This is how God is allowing us to "teach a man to fish," instead of just giving him a fish to eat.

The men are excited, and we covet your prayers for this self-sustaining project.

Our plan is to get a revolving system of 400 chickens each side (there are two rooms this size) alternating starting every three weeks, so the guys will only be selling 400 every three weeks instead of 800 every six!

What a joy to see the Lord touch hearts along the way without direct appeals for fundraising to get us to this point!

God is so good!

Bro. John and Esther Shrader
Zambia

with Arcade, Kapolo Jolisman, and Roderick

Also please be praying for Handia as he seeks God's plan and direction for his life. It looks like he might be starting Bible college classes with us as well as Bro. Eliud Phiri, bringing our first group to five!

https://www.facebook.com/john.shrader.125

Uh, yes.  Timothy House was where John offered the converts housing until he booted them out because he needed it.  Where is poor Arcade living now - refugee camp?

The men (most look like boys to me) could be self-supporting in actual jobs.  At least one of the men is probably better educated than John.  He seems to have had a scholarship to Columbia International College in Ontario and did his A levels there.   John's SOTDRT upbringing and online "masters" degree isn't worth as much.  

One at least was working in data-entry somewhere.  One of the others turned down a better job offer because John wanted him to stay in Kafue to be discipled.

Instead John wants to oversee them growing chickens and vegetables for him.

Interesting to see that John mentions Mr. Phiri again right after I commented that he seemed to have fled the coop.  

John's core Bible Study is still only 5 people.  That is his "Theological College."

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Five people in two years. Not a lot to say to that really. We are all thinking the same.:roll:

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Weren't some of those people already converts before John showed up? 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Uh, yes.  Timothy House was where John offered the converts housing until he booted them out because he needed it.  Where is poor Arcade living now - refugee camp?

I don't think that's the same place, although it's really hard to keep all John's houses straight.

The House on the Hill: John's family's original Zambian housing, which they had to move out of because the landlady was demon-possessed 

The Garden of Eden house: The place that was originally dedicated to housing John's converts and holding church services; the family now lives here because of the aforementioned demon-possessed landlady

The Timothy House: The house that John's disciples built with their own hands while John "helped"; it now has a giant chicken coop behind it that the men also built for their new moneymaking venture

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When John talks about a dependency mindset, I want to slap him.

Just saying...

14

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, slickcat79 said:

I don't think that's the same place, although it's really hard to keep all John's houses straight.

The House on the Hill: John's family's original Zambian housing, which they had to move out of because the landlady was demon-possessed 

The Garden of Eden house: The place that was originally dedicated to housing John's converts and holding church services; the family now lives here because of the aforementioned demon-possessed landlady

The Timothy House: The house that John's disciples built with their own hands while John "helped"; it now has a giant chicken coop behind it that the men also built for their new moneymaking venture

Don't forget the first house next to the mosque where John got all upset by the "satanic" calls to prayer. ;)

It is confusing but if you look at his FB quote above - the Shraders booted the men out because they had to move out of the House on the Hill - and they are definitely living in the Timothy House.  The giant chicken coop is in the back yard of the Timothy House - it was the chicken coop and the church that were built with the converts bare hands.

Edited by Palimpsest
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

This chicken business gives them invaluable experience in learning practical "tent-making" business skills, learning how to run and manage a business, the confidence of supporting themselves instead of a dependency mindset, and even saving for the future.

This is how God is allowing us to "teach a man to fish," instead of just giving him a fish to eat.

Several prayers -- the first is to the Universe:  Please please please let John post more things like this, because the irony is just beyond delicious!  

Prayer 2: Dear God, John has identified you as his go-to guy.  Please teach John to actually fish and make tents and not just be a fisher of men giving tent revivals. He's the father of a bazillion kids, and desperately needs a real skill besides impregnating his wife. 

5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.