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samurai_sarah

John Shrader Pt 9- Zealous in Zambia

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Palimpsest
21 hours ago, formergothardite said:

He is blowing through new grand ideas pretty fast now. So far, from what I can remember these are the things he has started and then dropped

~Plane ministry

~Building a Bible display case.

~Printing ministry(in reality he isn't actually doing much)

~Miracle Well to give away water

~Chicken idea

~Timothy Training House(people are living there, but it doesn't seem to live up to his grand claims)

~House on the Hill

~His magazine Truth Teller

And now he is going to start an unaccredited college, which I doubt will go far. 

I think there was also a radio ministry unless that was Rea.  Timothy House was supposed to be his Bible Training Institute until he decided a college would sound better.  To my joy he's now made himself an official logo/seal type thing for his latest brainwave.

John also built himself a snazzy donation box very early on.  Priorities, priorities.  

And according to his last FB post he is losing converts.  No surprise.

Quote

I'm requesting that you pray for four people by name that are heavy on my heart. Edson and his wife Prisca. Prisca is almost definitely not saved, and Edson professes to be, but has forsaken us, having loved this present world. The same could be said for Eugene and Precious. These dear people have heard the Truth, but the world is so alluring. 

Edson was the one who was baptized when John's parents were there.  Show and tell for Daddy Rick.  We also haven't heard anything about Bro. Kennedy recently, have we?  I think he's distanced himself too.

I'm still fixated on the land purchase for the church.  I really can't see that it was legal for him to buy land if he is having to renew a visitor's Visa every year.

So things John has managed to do:

-  built a church with money grifted after his sister's tragic death.  He said he would never build a bricks and mortar church.

- built a chicken coop for (so far) imaginary chickens.

- dug a well. 

I think he was taken in over the land, as with the plane, and the "seller" is going to reappear at any moment and take possession of the land, church, and well.  I remember even Bobby Bonner (20+ years experience in Zambia) cautioned him about the purchase at the time but John didn't listen.

I also wonder whether he paid import duty on the grifted piano and piles of beef jerky!

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BabyBottlePop

Funny how these fundies act like being unaccredited is a good thing, like actual accreditation is worldly. 

Upthread someone quoted John as calling his followers (?) "saints". As a Catholic this confuses me because I thought baptists didn't like our version of saints, connecting it to Mary veneration and "idolatry" and all that. I know he doesn't mean it in the Catholic way, but then what does he mean? 

I thought these people believed once saved, always saved. Why should John worry about Edson then? 

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EmiGirl
6 minutes ago, BabyBottlePop said:

Funny how these fundies act like being unaccredited is a good thing, like actual accreditation is worldly. 

Upthread someone quoted John as calling his followers (?) "saints". As a Catholic this confuses me because I thought baptists didn't like our version of saints, connecting it to Mary veneration and "idolatry" and all that. I know he doesn't mean it in the Catholic way, but then what does he mean? 

I thought these people believed once saved, always saved. Why should John worry about Edson then? 

Christians alive and dead are referred to as saints occasionally in the New Testament, mostly by Paul.

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CTRLZero
1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

I'm requesting that you pray for four people by name that are heavy on my heart. Edson and his wife Prisca. Prisca is almost definitely not saved, and Edson professes to be, but has forsaken us, having loved this present world. The same could be said for Eugene and Precious. These dear people have heard the Truth, but the world is so alluring. 

I wonder what started this stampede for the exit.  And how would John know if someone was "almost definitely" saved or not, wouldn't that be ultimately the call of a certain Higher Being?   Is the "present world" anything outside of John's control?   Questions, questions...

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Palimpsest
1 minute ago, EmiGirl said:

Christians alive and dead are referred to as saints occasionally in the New Testament, mostly by Paul.

Yes, saints as opposed to sinners and it depends on the translation because sometimes it is "holy" not saint.  I had to look it up.

KJV - 1 Corinthians 1:2 "Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours."

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BabyBottlePop

If John's way is the way to salvation-- and I don't believe it is, but heed me for a moment-- he has no way of knowing who may have accepted Jesus Christ and who hasn't. 

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EmiGirl
4 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Yes, saints as opposed to sinners and it depends on the translation because sometimes it is "holy" not saint.  I had to look it up.

KJV - 1 Corinthians 1:2 "Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours."

But we all know that the KJV is the only correct translation. :56247968a3f2c_Come-here-baby-cakes-wink:

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Gobsmacked

Was Precious the Midwife Esther used for the birth of Stephen? I'm probably confused. 

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Gobsmacked
2 hours ago, BabyBottlePop said:

If John's way is the way to salvation-- and I don't believe it is, but heed me for a moment-- he has no way of knowing who may have accepted Jesus Christ and who hasn't. 

Is it possible that John has questioned these people and told them that he (John) doesn't think they are " saved" enough?  I should imagine he hurts people's feelings every time he opens that huge gob of his anyway. 

They may have questioned John as to why he doesn't  think good works are a way to heaven. Also why he has now decided to build the super duper chicken factory to help the converts  earn money as surely that can be seen as a good work?

Hope that makes sense ?

 

 

Edited by Gobsmacked

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formergothardite

John doles out salvation and John can take it away the second someone crosses him. It is pretty telling that John didn't say that they had forsaken God, he said they had forsaken him. They did something to bruise his fragile ego and now they are going to hell in his mind. 

So his converts are jumping ship. I suspect John's slowly sinking ship is starting to sink a bit faster. 

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BabyBottlePop

Being told my form of Christianity would still lead me to hell would confuse and hurt me and not make me want to follow a new kind--the one that says I'm wrong. I'm sure John's followers feel the same.

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Palimpsest
On 8/14/2016 at 2:55 PM, Gobsmacked said:

Was Precious the Midwife Esther used for the birth of Stephen? I'm probably confused. 

I'm fairly sure the first midwife was Mrs, Zhiri.  I don't think they named midwife #2.  We haven't heard much about precious Mr. and Mrs. Zhiri recently either.  He was trying to convert them.

And fuck you, John Shrader!  I'd much rather hope for economic health and prosperity for Zambia!

Quote

After voting last Thursday, the results have finally been announced today. President Lungu has been reelected for a full five year term.

The nation overall seems fairly calm after a bitter and at times deadly ordinary campaign season.

Please continue to pray for Zambia, that the Lord will use the economic struggles, faltering economy, load shedding, and other struggles to soften people's hearts to the Gospel.

Thank you again for your prayers in this matter.

 

https://www.facebook.com/john.shrader.125 (public FB)

It is a contested election, BTW.  I have no idea what John means by "deadly ordinary."

 

 

 

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ViolaSebastian

Sweet lord, there is a LOT going on with this seal. And "Truth Biblical Baptist Theological College" does not exactly roll off the tongue. 

 

13900307_10206872480960769_8412441389875093370_n.jpg

Edited by ViolaSebastian

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Gobsmacked
47 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Sweet lord, there is a LOT going on with this seal. And "Truth Biblical Baptist Theological College" does not exactly roll off the tongue. 

 

13900307_10206872480960769_8412441389875093370_n.jpg

It's a total tongue twister! Try saying it quickly. John may have invented a new drinking game.:dance:

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Palimpsest
1 hour ago, Gobsmacked said:

It's a total tongue twister! Try saying it quickly. John may have invented a new drinking game.:dance:

Hee!  It doesn't exactly trip off the tongue.

It is also false advertising.  There is no "truth" in the Biblical Baptist Theological "College."  Discipling people in your living room or in a chicken coop =/= a real education and training.

Come on, John.  Printing a diploma and a seal for a non-existent theological "college" is false testimony.

False testimony is a sin. 

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countressrascal
3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

I'm fairly sure the first midwife was Mrs, Zhiri.  I don't think they named midwife #2.  We haven't heard much about precious Mr. and Mrs. Zhiri recently either.  He was trying to convert them.

And fuck you, John Shrader!  I'd much rather hope for economic health and prosperity for Zambia!

https://www.facebook.com/john.shrader.125 (public FB)

It is a contested election, BTW.  I have no idea what John means by "deadly ordinary."

 

 

 

I was going to say something very bad about him comparing the economic hardship opening people hearts to his snake oil. That is BS what the people need are a stable economy and education system for everyone. Not John boy BS 

 

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FloraKitty35
1 hour ago, countressrascal said:

people need are a stable economy and education system for everyone.

I agree those things (especially the latter one) are what the Zambian people need to tell snake oil sales like John off.

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formergothardite

John's latest FB post is the closest he has come to admitting his unthinking behavior causes problems. He must have really gotten called out for saying offensive things and it had to have been by people he couldn't pass off as being godless sinners. 

Quote

My struggle, oft times, is that my tongue answers BEFORE I allow the Lord, through the Holy Spirit, to prepare my heart.Would you please pray for me, that I not hastily "run over" the "speed bumps" of that still small voice?

Quote

If you are one whom I've damaged because I ignored that "spiritual speed bump" in the past, and I've failed to make it right, please message me so I can.

Now, I think in reality if anyone messages John he will refuse to admit his wrong and figure out a way to blame the other person. 

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FloraKitty35

Spiritual speed bumps, there are enough real ones to worry about.  Also, an airplane ministry, who does John think he is Wonder Woman (with her invisible jet)?

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MayMay1123
17 hours ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Sweet lord, there is a LOT going on with this seal. And "Truth Biblical Baptist Theological College" does not exactly roll off the tongue. 

 

 

at least he didn't spell it "collage"...

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quincygal
Quote

I also wonder whether he paid import duty on the grifted piano and piles of beef jerky!

In the US, they strongly encourage you to use a licensed customs broker.  They file your paperwork and pay on your behalf.  If you don't pay back your broker, they can send you to collwction.  Not sure how it works there though:(

Edited by Coconut Flan
Removed empty quote box.

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Gobsmacked

It sounds as though John boy may have upset a lot of people. He doesn't seem to know exactly who or how many though. His message was worded quite generally. Wonder if there has been a mass exodus from the shed church or if attendance has dwindled enough for his common sense to take over from his ego and actually notice?

I should imagine him telling folk not to move away to take up a decent job offer hasn't gone over to well.

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NikeKnees

Okay, lurker coming our of the lurk here. I work in Zambia part of the year and have a few things to add. 

1. The economy and electricity crisis are really, really bad. minimum 8-hours of loadshedding a day. While yes, you can pray that people draw near to God in struggle, he should also be praying that the people are eased of these burdens.

2. I have successfully gained a work permit in Zambia once. When I had to reapply under my married name I was rejected (due to the election). I work with one of the best lawyers in Lusaka on all of my immigration stuff and she couldn't even get me approved this time. I am appealing but the process will take a while. I am under an umbrella organization and STILL couldn't get my visa approved because Lungu was trying to make it look like he wasn't accepting foreign workers. He wanted it to look like he was saving jobs for Zambian nationals.

3. LAND. NO WAY CAN THIS GUY BUY LAND. There are so many hoops to jump through to own land in Zambia. You have to be a registered business or NGO in Zambia or a Zambian National to buy and own land. The organization for whom I work has the same lawyer work any of their land purchases and it is an expensive, lengthy, and bureaucratic process. If he has the land in the name of a Zambian, that individual can turn their back on John whenever and the land ownership will remain with the Zambian National. 

It sounds to me like John had a really unrealistic and romanticized idea of what it is like to be a missionary in Zambia (or anywhere). There is a little inkling of me that feels badly for him as he claws for some sort of remnant of his pride. 

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Palimpsest
7 hours ago, formergothardite said:

Now, I think in reality if anyone messages John he will refuse to admit his wrong and figure out a way to blame the other person. 

It would be great if instead of messaging they tell him in FB comments. :)

 

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Palimpsest
10 minutes ago, NikeKnees said:

Okay, lurker coming our of the lurk here. I work in Zambia part of the year and have a few things to add. 

1. The economy and electricity crisis are really, really bad. minimum 8-hours of loadshedding a day. While yes, you can pray that people draw near to God in struggle, he should also be praying that the people are eased of these burdens.

2. I have successfully gained a work permit in Zambia once. When I had to reapply under my married name I was rejected (due to the election). I work with one of the best lawyers in Lusaka on all of my immigration stuff and she couldn't even get me approved this time. I am appealing but the process will take a while. I am under an umbrella organization and STILL couldn't get my visa approved because Lungu was trying to make it look like he wasn't accepting foreign workers. He wanted it to look like he was saving jobs for Zambian nationals.

3. LAND. NO WAY CAN THIS GUY BUY LAND. There are so many hoops to jump through to own land in Zambia. You have to be a registered business or NGO in Zambia or a Zambian National to buy and own land. The organization for whom I work has the same lawyer work any of their land purchases and it is an expensive, lengthy, and bureaucratic process. If he has the land in the name of a Zambian, that individual can turn their back on John whenever and the land ownership will remain with the Zambian National. 

It sounds to me like John had a really unrealistic and romanticized idea of what it is like to be a missionary in Zambia (or anywhere). There is a little inkling of me that feels badly for him as he claws for some sort of remnant of his pride. 

Thank you so much for delurking.  Welcome.

1.  The situation sounds really bad.  It was hard to tell from the coverage whether it might have been better if the opposition had won the election. ITA about praying that the situation gets better.

2.  I don't think Shrader ever got a work permit - he lies to his funders when it suits him.  I think he is sliding by on an annual residency permit.  It seems a lot of these unofficial "missionaries" manage to do that.  My question is - what if he has forgotten to renew it?  How soon will they catch up to him?

3.  I knew that land purchase was total bunk!  I muddled my way through the Government regulations about foreign nationals buying land in Zambia.  The question is whether he is lying about having bought it  or whether he genuinely thinks he owns it.  I think he was probably completely conned by a "seller" perhaps in collusion with a Zambian "convert."  A case of a conman (John) being out-conned by better conmen.  As with the disappearing plane.

You are nice to be able to feel badly for him.  It is not just that he has romantic ideas - he is also completely irresponsible, slapdash, and careless with other people's money.  His donors are unbelievably naive - and fools and enablers.  

I lost all sympathy for Shrader long ago.  I only feel sorry for his wife and children.

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