Tim LaHaye Dead at Age 90

[DomWackTroll]

Dr. Timothy F. “Tim” LaHaye, the son of a Detroit autoworker who grew up to become a respected pastor, international best-seller and prominent evangelical leader, died July 25, 2016 at Grossmont hospital in La Mesa, Calif., just days after suffering a stroke. He was 90 years old.

Dr. LaHaye is perhaps most noted for his blockbuster best-selling book series “Left Behind,” which he co-wrote with fellow author Jerry B. Jenkins.

http://christiannewsjournal.com/tim-lahaye-evangelical-leader-and-left-behind-co-author-passes-at-90/

 

[hoipolloi]

Well, if Dr. LaHaye is actually in heaven, he's probably going to be very, very surprised at who else is there with him.

One wonders if he'll rebuke the Lord over His indiscriminate saving of souls.

[Loveday]

I hate to speak ill of the dead, no matter who they are, but that Left Behind series is some of the worst writing ever put between book covers. 

 

 

[Maggie Mae]

8 minutes ago, Loveday said:

I hate to speak ill of the dead, no matter who they are, but that Left Behind series is some of the worst writing ever put between book covers. 

Yes, but without it, we wouldn't have had "Left Behind Fridays" which has given me hours of entertainment. 

[Loveday]

37 minutes ago, Maggie Mae said:

Yes, but without it, we wouldn't have had "Left Behind Fridays" which has given me hours of entertainment. 

 Ermagerd.  Er. Ma. Gerd.  

If y'all don't see me for awhile, please send out the ferrets. 

 

 

[CyborgKin]

I had no idea he was that old!

[ADoyle90815]

Kirk Cameron is mourning the loss of material for his films.

[CrazyCatLady]

I had no idea he was that old!

No joke. I thought he was like 60...

[AmazonGrace]

He missed the Rapture huh. Condolences for his loved ones. I read something he wrote about depression and it was useful to me at the time but it was another lifetime ago and not sure I'd see it the same way now

[Marian the Librarian]

And to add to the fun - Kelly Reins (the oldest "Ah, The Life" - er) is now speculating on FB about LaHaye's eternal whereabouts:

Quote

"Scary to think what he's facing now."

There is much ensuing discussion (fair warning: the semantics and hair-splitting boggle the mind):

Quote

 

Lydia Grenier While I certainly didn't agree with him on everything, I have no reason to believe he isn't in Heaven. He loved the Lord!

Kelly Reins It's not enough to have feelings of Love for God. God requires us to live beholdenn to grace and obey Him in Chist Jesus. "Those who love me, you will keep my commandments." John 14:15

Lydia Grenier Well of course! But what did he do that makes him heretical in your eyes? He spent his life serving the Lord, seemingly obeying Him (as far as anyone can know of course) and although I disagree with him on *many* points, that doesn't mean he wasn't saved!

Lydia Grenier I guess I simply don't see an alternate view of end times as meaning someone isn't saved...

Kelly Reins His view of end times change a large portion of our culture's understanding of the here and now through the perpetuation of a false gospel. It's not just an 'alternate view' if that helps. :)

Kassandra Small What do you mean Kelly?

Kelly Reins He perpetuated a false gospel broadly through his books.

Kelly Reins The question we have to answer is, "Is there any hope of a peace in the present or in our lives' future, is any of our work relevant if we’re living in the last days and Jesus is returning soon?" It's an eschatological (end times) question which the Bible speaks to very well. LaHaye's interpretation of end times undermines the gospel. The gospel transforms all of life, all of man, not just his soul. It transforms his actions, his work, his intellect, his policies, etc. LaHaye's worldview removes responsibility and hope from the Christian laboring in the present and promises hope only in the future in another world. In reality, Christ is reigning now, is here now, the victor always, working through His people to establish His kingdom on this earth. He blesses us in business for example, and wants good men and women prospering and governing righteously and according to His laws. That is how culture is changed. We've a hopeful today as well as a hopeful tomorrow because Christ is not aloof in the present.

Melissa Merritt Kelly Reins, I beg to differ....My family and I agree with his end times theology (perhaps not entirely), and still believe the gospel, and believe in God's transforming power in and through our lives, through Christ. But one day when Christ returns things will all be righted, not through man's paltry efforts!

Melissa Merritt Premill/pretrib theology does not remove our responsibility to act according to God's law or to witness to others, or seek to make changes in laws.

Melissa Merritt Now LaHaye's theology was probably Arminian, so take that how you will, but I believe he did point to Jesus as the substitute for sin and changer of hearts.

Shannon Brewer Land Kelly-- I didn't really get that at all from those books. Am wondering now if I missed some..?

Krystina Steed He Left Behind a package of lies and twisted scripture.

Mac White That is what I like, a direct answer!!!  :)

Shannon Brewer Land I think it's very dangerous to presume we know where one lands after his/her mortal life expires... We are obligated to be "fruit inspectors", not Judges. That remains our Sovereign God's exclusive right. There may be something I don't know, but I never saw rotten "fruit" from this gentleman.

Kelly Reins Shannon, what scriptural guidelines do you use so that you can discern what is good fruit? Are they the same as those you use to discern counterfeit good fruit?

Krystina Steed Left Behind series = rotten fruit

Shannon Brewer Land Kelly-- of course!!

Shannon Brewer Land We're warned not to add or take away anything from scripture... I just don't recall he and Jerry Jenkins ever doing either of those things. They wrote a work of fiction loosely based on scriptures to make the secular world more aware of what it would face. Thousands have turned to the Lord and, thus, began to read the Bible because of it.

Kelly Reins I'm actually asking :) How are you able to tell the difference between real good fruit and counterfeit good fruit?

Janine Bowling Thought you might be poking at a hornet's nest.... ;)

Kelly Reins :) I wasn't actually. There will always be nests. I wasn't being sarcastic at all. Just reflecting. His reach was vast. His teaching affected many.

Janine Bowling No, I knew you weren't sarcastic. Bob and Josh and I have often spoken of the responsibility of speaking rightly about the Word of God and His laws whether it's in a teaching role or "fictional" works. It is quite sobering to think of all the consequences to the millions of people who absobed this "story" into their theology.

Ken Puckett While I think his eschatology was incorrect I think his soteriology was sound. Eschatology is strongly debated in the church soteriology is not up for debate.

 

Fruit inspectors! Soteriology! Eschatology! Lions and tigers and bears, oh my!! 

[kpmom]

I just don't get fundies at all.

OTOH, they tell people just to pray the sinner's prayer and they will be saved.  That's it.

Later, if the person does not interpret scripture exactly  the way they do, he's going to hell.

They bitch about the Catholics and works based salvation, but how are they different?

 

[nausicaa]

18 minutes ago, kpmom said:

They bitch about the Catholics and works based salvation, but how are they different?

 

Cause one of them dirty Papists might feed a homeless person or start a school in Africa or something. They only engage in navel gazing conversations on Facebook.

[THERetroGamerNY]

He didn't die... He was raptured!

[libriatrix]

I love how being a fruit inspector is somehow different from judging. Said in the context of declaring fruit to be good or bad, which is... judging? 9_9

[smittykins]

1 hour ago, kpmom said:

I just don't get fundies at all.

OTOH, they tell people just to pray the sinner's prayer and they will be saved.  That's it.

Later, if the person does not interpret scripture exactly  the way they do, he's going to hell.

They bitch about the Catholics and works based salvation, but how are they different?

 

I've seen this so many times(Jack Chick, televangelists).  "Give your life to Jesus and you'll go to heaven!  That's it!"

"Then, write for my free book, so you'll know what to do next!"(Pray[in your own words], read the[KJV]Bible, join[an approved]church, tell others about Jesus, etc., etc, etc...)

[hoipolloi]

1 hour ago, kpmom said:

I just don't get fundies at all.

OTOH, they tell people just to pray the sinner's prayer and they will be saved.  That's it.

Later, if the person does not interpret scripture exactly  the way they do, he's going to hell.

They bitch about the Catholics and works based salvation, but how are they different?

 

And then there are the Mormons whom most fundies do not consider to be Christian. Given that, it makes you wonder why they don't send more missionaries to Utah, as opposed to Zambia.

Also, looks like I should edit my prior comment -- maybe something like this:

16 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Well, if Dr. LaHaye is actually in heaven, he's probably going to be very, very surprised at who else is there with him.

Well, if Dr. LaHaye, is actually in heaven, and if Kelly Reims & Krystina Steed eventually get there, too, they're all going to be very, very surprised at who else the Lord allowed through the Pearly Gates! 

[Black Aliss]

27 minutes ago, hoipolloi said:

Well, if Dr. LaHaye, is actually in heaven, and if Kelly Reims & Krystina Steed eventually get there, too, they're all going to be very, very surprised at who else the Lord allowed through the Pearly Gates! 

Especially if I'm right and heaven and hell are exactly the same place, which they would have to be if they exist at all. Because hell for me would be an eternity spent with all the people who, on this earth, have been telling me they're going to heaven and I'm not.

[Coconut Flan]

Is this the spot to insert my favorite Eastern Orthodox joke?

An Orthodox believer dies and goes to Heaven.  St Peter is taking him on a tour and they come to a very high brick wall.  St Peter says SHHH be very quiet.  The Orthodox believer asks why?  St Peter says because that's where we have all the Fundamentalists/Baptists.  They think they're the only ones here and we don't want to upset them. 

[PennySycamore]

@Coconut Flan, your telling an Eastern Orthodox joke makes me miss Arete! She was always so good at explaining the Orthodox POV.   RIP, Arete!

[nastyhobbitses]

16 hours ago, ADoyle90815 said:

Kirk Cameron is mourning the loss of material for his films.

It's OK, he can keep making more of those "I'm an asshole to my wife but then I told Jesus I was sowwy and now it's OK and I'm going to awkwardly hug my female costar because I'm afraid of cheating on my wife if I kiss anyone but her" movies he does with the Kendrick brothers.

[Coconut Flan]

9 minutes ago, PennySycamore said:

 

@Coconut Flan, your telling an Eastern Orthodox joke makes me miss Arete! She was always so good at explaining the Orthodox POV.   RIP, Arete!

 

Yes, she and I had many a good Orthodox conversation and she helped me a lot in some decisions I made.  This is still making me cry.  May her memory be eternal. 

[CyborgKin]

4 hours ago, nastyhobbitses said:

It's OK, he can keep making more of those "I'm an asshole to my wife but then I told Jesus I was sowwy and now it's OK and I'm going to awkwardly hug my female costar because I'm afraid of cheating on my wife if I kiss anyone but her" movies he does with the Kendrick brothers.

He wasn't involved in their latest couple of movies.  These days he just does documentaries which largely consist of his face uncomfortably close to the camera.

 

As for 'going to heaven' I'm very unclear on what that means.  Or what 'heaven' means in the Bible.  Mostly it means sky or space, so... *shrug*

[Hummingbird]

Fruit inspectors?? (GiggleSnort)

[Ex-Creationist]

38 minutes ago, Hummingbird said:

Fruit inspectors?? (GiggleSnort)

Ahh, memories! I was raised by fundies, so "fruit inspectors" were real things. But it wasn't being Judgy McJudgerson. That's different. Somehow. I never REALLY understood how that was different, but it was--or so I was told a whole bunch of times.

Of course, I ALSO rolled my eyes at the pastor's wife who explained that the verse in Matthew reads, in full, to judge not let you be judged by the same measure. In other words--which I figured out after having a conversation with her--it's totally cool to judge as long as you're cool with being judged for identical or at least comparable "sins." In other words, if a person has never done X, then that person can feel free to "inspect fruit" and find you lacking if you've done/are doing X. 

There are more-charitable interpretations of that, of course. I know Christians who take that passage to mean that we ALL struggle with something, so we should be compassionate and supportive. 

My takeaway from my church and pastor and pastor's wife was that "fruit inspector" and "judgmental jerk" were interchangeable. Your mileage may vary, of course. 

[Marian the Librarian]

5 hours ago, Hummingbird said:

Fruit inspectors?? (GiggleSnort)

You have to be very careful around most fruits - they're nothing but sex in disguise, y'know. Plump, fuzzy peaches...Eve's tempting apple...grapes, bursting with flavor...and don't even get me started on bananas!