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Seventeen - Not the Magazine - Bateseseses Threads!


SpoonfulOSugar

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One Bates new baby.

One pregnancy soon to end.

Endless discussion about the 2nd generation.

 

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Katie looks gorgeous in the last picture in Bates IG but it makes me angry Kelly's comment pretending she spends lots of one-to-one time with her children. She probably likes spending some time with older girls, but I very much doubt it's enough time for a teen girl. And I don't think she's spending quality time with ANY of the boys or the little girls. You have to be a girl and wait 14 years to start a relationship with this mother.

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Can I just say that I think some of these Bates fans on IG are downright creepy.  Someone already made an account for Kaci Lynn and recently accounts were made for the youngest 2 sons.

I just think it's wrong to make a social media account using a minor's name.

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Yes Becky weirds me out so bad. She will say stuff like "Can Erin and Whitney take a bump picture together" or "Alyssa, do you have any pics from Father's Day?" It's totally creepy. In the comments one time she said something along the lines of praying for Michael because she wasn't pregnant yet and she was in her prayers. It makes my skin crawl. 

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The reason why wearing pants and helping her husband with his business don't count as valid proof is because they are both well within the realm of acceptable behavior for IBLP members.  Now yeah, what constitutes valid proof is going to differ from person to person, but I think for most people it would have to be something that is actually unacceptable for IBLP members to do.

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Speaking of the aforementioned Becky M of instagram notierity, I wonder why she was saying she was sorry for what happened on Michaela' and Brandon ' s account a while back. She also seems to have had a private message with Michaela. So far not a peep about her upcoming graduation though.

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I bet you guys are right about meeting Bobby's parents. They must know them somehow. Maybe they just don't know them very well. They never seem to tell the whole truth. Which is just so annoying. But all the other people that have married or courted a Bates have been ATI/IBLP. So I'm more curious about these two since they may be the first in the family not to be a couple made in Gothard heaven.

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1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I bet you guys are right about meeting Bobby's parents. They must know them somehow. Maybe they just don't know them very well. They never seem to tell the whole truth. Which is just so annoying. But all the other people that have married or courted a Bates have been ATI/IBLP. So I'm more curious about these two since they may be the first in the family not to be a couple made in Gothard heaven.

Well, Whitney wasn't IBLP but that is less important because she was a woman and bound to follow Zach's headship after marriage (in theory). For the moment when it comes to the Bate's, any courter is IBLP until proven otherwise in my mind (which we will know this week after the show). This is the Bates' moment in the sun for their cult. They can probably make any match for their daughters they want (er, sorry, I mean, given how much god has smiled upon them and blessed them I'm sure he has arranged many godly couples within the cult to come along in his perfect timing).

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4 hours ago, crazysnark said:

Yes Becky weirds me out so bad. She will say stuff like "Can Erin and Whitney take a bump picture together" or "Alyssa, do you have any pics from Father's Day?" It's totally creepy. In the comments one time she said something along the lines of praying for Michael because she wasn't pregnant yet and she was in her prayers. It makes my skin crawl. 

Yep, she makes my skin crawl too. Seriously, I think Becky M has a living room wall plastered with Bates photos. Thank goodness she lives far away from them.

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I've always avoided this, but now that I finally signed up here, I feel I can't be a proper Free Jinger member unless I learn about the Bateses. I am going to now confess I mostly watch "quality" TV...

But I spend most of the summer enjoying junk food books, so I thought maybe why not TV as well? I am recording some of the Bates' show in a couple days, and also two about the McGhee family, who have sextuplets, but I think they're maybe not really very nutball.

And I've had a look at all these pages, but it's a lot to slog through. Is there an Idiot's Guide or Cliff's Notes for this? I read fast, but do have life and stuff. Please and thank you.

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21 minutes ago, backyard sylph said:

I've always avoided this, but now that I finally signed up here, I feel I can't be a proper Free Jinger member unless I learn about the Bateses. I am going to now confess I mostly watch "quality" TV...

But I spend most of the summer enjoying junk food books, so I thought maybe why not TV as well? I am recording some of the Bates' show in a couple days, and also two about the McGhee family, who have sextuplets, but I think they're maybe not really very nutball.

And I've had a look at all these pages, but it's a lot to slog through. Is there an Idiot's Guide or Cliff's Notes for this? I read fast, but do have life and stuff. Please and thank you.

Long story short:

- Gil meets Kelly at University. 

- Gil and Kelly marry and start having kids.

- Gil decides working is hard and quits good job with Nabisco to grift. He sometimes has a Tree Business too. Hard times begin in which there are too many mouths and never enough food.

- Somehow they get involved with Gothard. They start dressing like 1800's prairie folk. They also decide Birth Control is the Devil. They fuck like bunnies and have 19 kids.

- They meet the Duggars and guest star on their freak show. They get their own freak show on TLC for one season. At some point their house is given a big addition - I assume this was thanks to TLC. A few years later they get a new show on UP, in which they offer a highly sanitized and prettied up picture of being a normal family (with 19 freaking kids. Who they force to raise each other. And who they train to behave.)

- Children are being married off in quick succession. The daughters have all seemed to marry within the IBLP fold so far.

- Erin married Chad Paine (whose father is on the Board) in November 2013. They suffered multiple miscarriages due to a clotting disorder. They live in Tennessee. They have a son, Carson (May 2015), and expect a daughter, Brooklyn, this summer.

- Alyssa married John Webster (whose father is the frighteningly conservative politician Taliban Dan) in May 2014. They live in Florida and have one daughter, Allie Jane (April 2015). 

- And Michael married Brandon Keilen (who works at IBLP Headquarters) in August 2015. They live in Chicago and have no children as of right now.

- Their eldest, Zach, married a non-IBLP girl named Whitney after his extremely awkward courtship to an IBLP woman failed epically. Whitney and Zach had dirty pre-marital kissing and she became quickly convicted to wear skirts only. They live in Tennessee. They have a son, Bradley (October 2014), and a daughter, Kaci Lynn (June 2016.)

- Gil rises through the ranks at IBLP and is appointed to the Board of Directors. Gil helps conceal sexual abuse of young women by Gothard. Gothard falls from favor after lawsuit alleging the sexual abuse goes public. Gil, and his Board buddies, drop Gothard like a hot potato.

Thats all I have time for now. Basically, they're a shinier looking turd then the Duggars - but they're still a turd abd they still smell like shit if you get close enough.

 

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47 minutes ago, backyard sylph said:

I've always avoided this, but now that I finally signed up here, I feel I can't be a proper Free Jinger member unless I learn about the Bateses. I am going to now confess I mostly watch "quality" TV...

But I spend most of the summer enjoying junk food books, so I thought maybe why not TV as well? I am recording some of the Bates' show in a couple days, and also two about the McGhee family, who have sextuplets, but I think they're maybe not really very nutball.

And I've had a look at all these pages, but it's a lot to slog through. Is there an Idiot's Guide or Cliff's Notes for this? I read fast, but do have life and stuff. Please and thank you.

Cliffs Notes on the Bateses

If you're familiar with the Duggars, they're very similar.  Gil and Kelly Bates have 19 kids (ages 4-27) and first came to fame by being on 17 Kids and Counting dressed like extras on Little House on the Prairie.  They've since modernized their attire.  Gil runs a tree service and serves on the board of directors at ATI/IBLP.  They live in the hills of TN.

They have four kids married with another two courting (although one might be kaput).  The three married daughters all married ATI/IBLP royalty (another BOD's son, Congressman's son, HQ employee).  The married son married a woman who became more fundie upon marriage for one reason or another.  Their fourth grandchild (Kaci Lynn) was born last week and their 5th is on the way.

They've been on the Duggars TV show, been featured on 20/20 specials, had a TLC show called United Bates of America, and now have a show called 'Bringing Up Bates" on UP.  While they used to be portrayed as a freak show but now they're one big happy family.

Much has been said about daughter Alyssa (married to Congressman Dan Webster's son-- the congressman was called Taliban Dan by a political opponent and the nickname sticks here) showing baby steps leaving the lifestyle by wearing pants and cutting her hair.  Last week, Alyssa shut down her Instagram because she was sick of the haters.

Cliffs notes on the other notable kidults mentioned here a lot (left the minors  out of it)
Zach-- Married to Whitney (non fundie he met at Sonic) and has two adorable children (Bradley and Kaci).   Previously held political office and now works as a cop.  Had a courtship fail with Sarah that caused the family to change the rules.
Michael/Michaela/Michaella-- Married to Brandon (HQ employee) last August and lives in Chicago.  So far no pregnancy announcement
Erin-- married to Chad (bod's son) and pregnant with her 2nd child.  Teaches piano lessons and has recorded 3 piano albums.  Has pregnancy related health issues and struggles with carrying a baby to term.
Lawson-- Wannabe country star.  Only single 20+ kidult.  Opens his mouth on social media way too much.
Nathan-- Courting Ashley, a girl from the Bronx.  The next episode may or may not show them breaking up.  Most likely in line for the tree business
Alyssa-- Married to John and lives in FL.  Have a 15 month old daughter Allie Jane
Tori-- Loudmouth extrovert.  Is in Crown (aka Clown) college (Bible college) studying education.  Courting Bobby, a student at Pensacola Christian College
Trace-- took over lawn care business Lawson started
Carlin-- Just graduated HS (with brother Trace).  As loud and obnoxious as Tori.  BFF with Joy Anna Duggar.

 

Only minor I'll mention is youngest daughter Callie (6).  She was best known as the flower girl crying hysterically during her sister's wedding last year.  Very attached to sister mom Michael, but also sassy.  

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Ooohhh. Thank you for this, VelociRapture and 19 cats and counting.

I'll never get my head wrapped around it all. I don't see what they really receive from brainwashing their children. No religous discipline I learned of through early adulthood, and some of them were way extra-biblical, would have fit themselves into this puzzle frame. It's unsustainable. But of course, you all know that.

I remember them vaguely from watching the Duggars, but I had to stop watching that; it was consuming some brain cells and I don't have extras to spare this decade. So when I see them brought up elsewhere, it's kind of Charlie Brown's teacher. But now I will watch, a little, and learn...something.

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To continue a bit:

- Nathan is courting Ashley Salyer, aka the Bronx Bombshell. He asked her to court in a ridiculously, over-the-top, elaborate proposal set in Manhattan around early December. She indicated she thought he might be proposing for real. Recent episodes have pointed toward a bit of trouble in paradise - likely stemming from personality and lifestyle differences. Nathan and his siblings have made comments in multiple talking heads about her being a "city slicker" who "talks really fast."

- Tori is courting some guy named Bobby. He was introduced during a recent episode. Jury is out on how Fundie this guy is.

- The Bateses decided a few years back to make their big family holiday happen on Valentine's Day rather than Christmas. Alyssa came up with the idea and they went with it so the married and courting kids didn't feel like they were being forced to choose which family to spend Christmas with. One of the few things they've done that I think is a decent idea.

- There was a lot of speculation about whether Lawson was interested in courting Jinger Duggar in recent years. She just announced she's courting Jeremy Vuolo, the PreacherSoccerPlayerIWillSaveYourSoul Dude. Jury is out on how Lawson's achy breaky heart may be doing.

- Their courting standards are similar to the Duggar's. They claim that their kids can choose their own standards to an extent. For instance, kissing before marriage (like Zachney) is still a no-no. But some of the couple's are cool with front hugs and hand holding. They also allow limited alone time for the couple's to talk - one episode showed Kelly and Gil walking a short distance behind Michael and Brandon so they could talk in a bit of privacy.

- They believe the man is Head of the Household. That means he has final say on everything. They may show the couple's discussing things - but I would be very surprised if the man didn't get the final word in most cases. This means the man can decide such things as whether the wife can work outside the home and what modesty standards the women and children will adhere to.

- An important reminder that @formergotharditemakes every so often is that there is no strict code that all the families follow for clothing. The Duggars and Bateses follow the strict version recommended and preferred by Gothard - meaning long curly hair, skirts or dresses only, high necklines, and at least knee length bottoms for women. Other families, such as the Websters and Salyers, allow a more relaxed standard where the women can wear pants and sleeveless shirts.

- IBLP followers also seem to take the Bible literally. Meaning many of these families honestly think the world is 6,000 years old and that Jesus rode on Velociraptors.

- They also teach that women can cause men to stumble by "tempting" them. This is a big reason for the modesty standards. 

- The women's sins can also be blamed for miscarriages - it's seen as God's punishment. Which is pretty fucked up. I hope Erin and Chad Paine don't believe that shit.

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Front hugs! How progressive of them. Probably it helps that they are not performed with exposed shoulders.

I know something about being blamed for another's sickness due to my "sin," many years ago. It's the worst, because even though I knew it could not possibly be true, I still couldn't make anything better. If that makes any sense. And since something close to half of all pregnancies end in miscarriage, that's an awful lot of "sin," isn't it? 

I saw a TV ad for the Bates' show this evening. A son was about to have an important talk with his father, about a girl. I think he said she had a good heart. Which was my mother's code for "...I know her cheese has clearly slid right off her cracker," a delightful expression I just lifted from another discussion here. But I don't think that's what the young man was saying.

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15 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

Katie looks gorgeous in the last picture in Bates IG but it makes me angry Kelly's comment pretending she spends lots of one-to-one time with her children. She probably likes spending some time with older girls, but I very much doubt it's enough time for a teen girl. And I don't think she's spending quality time with ANY of the boys or the little girls. You have to be a girl and wait 14 years to start a relationship with this mother.

She is lovely. Did you notice the hashtag bumbaround? I thought Kelly went to college. *snark*

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21 hours ago, TuringMachine said:

The reason why wearing pants and helping her husband with his business don't count as valid proof is because they are both well within the realm of acceptable behavior for IBLP members.  Now yeah, what constitutes valid proof is going to differ from person to person, but I think for most people it would have to be something that is actually unacceptable for IBLP members to do.

I understand about working and pants- It seems that many people are able to point out what isn't valid proof, yet no one has been to articulate exactly what would provide valid proof. Imo, there will be many subtle moves away-

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On ‎6‎/‎29‎/‎2016 at 10:26 AM, Melissa1977 said:

Katie looks gorgeous in the last picture in Bates IG but it makes me angry Kelly's comment pretending she spends lots of one-to-one time with her children. She probably likes spending some time with older girls, but I very much doubt it's enough time for a teen girl. And I don't think she's spending quality time with ANY of the boys or the little girls. You have to be a girl and wait 14 years to start a relationship with this mother.

There is a little Bates boy in the background of the picture.  Sadly, I don't think Kelly was spending ANY special time with Katie.  

Katie looks beautiful in that picture.  It might be the angle, but it looks like she is losing her baby face "look" and her face is maturing ... becoming more elongated. 

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1 hour ago, JMO said:

@backyard sylph, the first few pages of the thread about the Bates before they shiny is a good intro.  And Youtube has a lot of the old episodes and specials. 

We first meet the Bateses on a 17 Kids episode called "When Big Families Collide."  It's on YouTube in 3 parts.

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2 hours ago, SassyPants said:

I understand about working and pants- It seems that many people are able to point out what isn't valid proof, yet no one has been to articulate exactly what would provide valid proof. Imo, there will be many subtle moves away-

I would say cutting off all association with IBLP. As long as they are still allowing themselves to be used to promote the cult I'm going to put them firmly in the still not moving away from the cult camp. And all the adults were used to try to entice people to attend the family conferences.

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Just watched this week's boring Bringing Up Bates Facebook livestream, nothing really interesting happened. No mention of Nathan and Ashley but there could be an out with the old in with the new situation as Judson teased Lawson about a girl named Mariah or something like that. Katie said Lawson was single because he couldn't get a girl to 'put up with him' probably because he put his foot in his mouth as we all know he has a habit of doing. The leghumpers in the comments are obsessed with asking questions about Lawson's dating life and that seems to be all they ask. Overall just the regular yawnfest.

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In the episode I saw, Nathan sat down with his parents and told them that he and Ashley have broken up.  Still friends though.

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Just now, Dandruff said:

In the episode I saw, Nathan sat down with his parents and told them that he and Ashley have broken up.  Still friends though.

I haven't seen the episode as I live in the UK but the clips I did see on UPs website are actually really upsetting. Nathan genuinely seemed devastated!

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Can someone tell me when Gil Bates joined the board? I've been having trouble figuring this out.

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