2nd Gen Duggar/Bates birth comparison

[JermajestyDuggar]

Since Alyssa married so much younger than Kelly and got pregnant right away, it is possible she could go past 19 kids. But knowing Alyssa's personality, she will probably have 5 or 6 at the most.

[OrchidBlossom]

7 hours ago, elliha said:

I get having one kid and having another at 15-24 months. I don't get doing it over and over and over for so many years. My sister had her first 3 over 3,5 years. She admits to it being hard but not impossible. I do think her waiting another 11 years until she had another one does say something. I have one daughter and pregnant with another child due the same month she will have her 4th birthday. It feels just about the right space. It took to her being 2,5 almost 3 years before I felt ready for another one. I think I could have done 2 years and not killed myself but it would have been extremely hard for me. I do dream about 3 kids and this might mean slightly closer spacing between 2 and 3 but no shorter than 2 years.

I think that this is why so many fundamentalist women have serious breakdowns (think Michelle's laundry incident) or look so detached and checked out. I also think it explains sister-moms. One person cannot do it all.

[Bad Wolf]

So, by the time I'd had 2 kids, Kelly and Michelle had 10. We sropped after 2.

[TuringMachine]

Man. At the age my mom had her first child (my brother) Kelly already had 9 children and Michelle already had 11. That is so insane! And by the time my mom had me (second child) Kelly was up to 12 and Michelle was up to 13 (and pregnant with #14). It's so insane to think about.

[Alachantal]

6 hours ago, JesusCampSongs said:

So, at my age of 31, Kelly and Michelle both had 9 kids. 

There's not enough fuck that in the world for this. omg. My cat is plenty, thanks.

I know right? When people ask if the bf and I have kids I'm like yep, my daughter is 4.5 years and my son is 11 weeks and oh by the way they're both cats  Two cats is more than enough for us. I don't know how the hell Both those women could have that many kids

[Yes, TOTALLY]

I know of a 25 year old woman who has 9 children. She had the first at 15 and just kept on going. She could beat Michelle and Kelly if she keeps on like she is!

[Melissa1977]

At my age they had like 15-16 kids!!!

I have two, not close in age, and they're my life and I love being a mom. But sometimes I'm dreaming they go to bed so I can have a quiet time to myself. Maybe I'm weak but no way I could stand 15 kids (nor 8!). 

And what about pregnancies? It's not so easy. Even in a good pregnancy, energy is not the same. How can the baby develop well if the mother is fighting with 15 kids all day long? It must be stressful. Not to forget the "older" kids of 1, 3, 5, 7 years old who need mummy but mummy is ALWAYS too busy. Sad.

At my age they had like 15-16 kids!!!

I have two, not close in age, and they're my life and I love being a mom. But sometimes I'm dreaming they go to bed so I can have a quiet time to myself. Maybe I'm weak but no way I could stand 15 kids (nor 8!). 

And what about pregnancies? It's not so easy. Even in a good pregnancy, energy is not the same. How can the baby develop well if the mother is fighting with 15 kids all day long? It must be stressful. Not to forget the "older" kids of 1, 3, 5, 7 years old who need mummy but mummy is ALWAYS too busy. Sad.

[Karma]

I'm two months younger than Michelle - 49.  Thank goodness for birth control, since both of my kids (now 19 & 16) were conceived the first month of trying.  I have had a Mirena for 5 years, so needed a blood test to see if I was near menopause or whether it will need replacing.  My GP said its just as well mr karma has had the snip, since my hormone levels indicate I'm still fertile. (If my eggs are not past their use by date!) Scary to think of how many kids I'd have had if I had been Quiverfull.

There would definitely have been laundry melt downs in my house with more than two!

[anjulibai]

On 5/27/2016 at 9:01 PM, crazysnark said:

I misspoke I meant Michael and Erin who are a whopping 17 Months apart. Haha. In the beginning with this exception she was popping them out every 13-14 months. INSANE!! My daughter just turned 2 last month and is so clingy and is such a baby to me. I can't imagine having 2 other children younger than her. 

Not sure how you are doing your analysis, but I have something different. Michael and Erin are 464 days apart, which is equivalent to 15.5 months apart (assuming a 30 day month average). 

These, btw, are my calculations in terms of months apart for the Bateses:

Birthdate     Name    Months since last birth

30-Dec-88    Zach    
23-Jan-90    Michael    13.0
2-May-91    Erin    15.5
27-Jul-92    Lawson    15.1
29-Aug-93    Nathan    13.3
9-Nov-94    Alyssa    14.6
20-Dec-95    Tori    13.5
1-Feb-97    Trace    13.6
11-Apr-98    Carlin    14.5
4-Aug-99    Josie    16.0
5-Oct-00    Katie    14.3
17-Feb-02    Jackson    16.7
19-May-03    Warden    15.2
16-Oct-04    Isaiah    17.2
17-Feb-06    Addallee    16.3
28-Apr-07    Ellie    14.5
2-Aug-09    Callie    27.6
15-Sep-10    Judson    13.6
1-Feb-12    Jeb    16.8

From my calculations, BTW, n average,  Kelly had a baby every 15.6 months and Michelle had a baby every 16.6 months. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

47 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

Not sure how you are doing your analysis, but I have something different. Michael and Erin are 464 days apart, which is equivalent to 15.5 months apart (assuming a 30 day month average). 

These, btw, are my calculations in terms of months apart for the Bateses:

Birthdate     Name    Months since last birth

30-Dec-88    Zach    
23-Jan-90    Michael    13.0
2-May-91    Erin    15.5
27-Jul-92    Lawson    15.1
29-Aug-93    Nathan    13.3
9-Nov-94    Alyssa    14.6
20-Dec-95    Tori    13.5
1-Feb-97    Trace    13.6
11-Apr-98    Carlin    14.5
4-Aug-99    Josie    16.0
5-Oct-00    Katie    14.3
17-Feb-02    Jackson    16.7
19-May-03    Warden    15.2
16-Oct-04    Isaiah    17.2
17-Feb-06    Addallee    16.3
28-Apr-07    Ellie    14.5
2-Aug-09    Callie    27.6
15-Sep-10    Judson    13.6
1-Feb-12    Jeb    16.8

From my calculations, BTW, n average,  Kelly had a baby every 15.6 months and Michelle had a baby every 16.6 months. 

Yes. Kelly is actually much more fertile than Michelle in that she's had more pregnancies. Kelly had 23 while Michelle had 19. I'm including miscarriages. 

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

17 hours ago, elliha said:

I get having one kid and having another at 15-24 months. I don't get doing it over and over and over for so many years. My sister had her first 3 over 3,5 years. She admits to it being hard but not impossible. I do think her waiting another 11 years until she had another one does say something. I have one daughter and pregnant with another child due the same month she will have her 4th birthday. It feels just about the right space. It took to her being 2,5 almost 3 years before I felt ready for another one. I think I could have done 2 years and not killed myself but it would have been extremely hard for me. I do dream about 3 kids and this might mean slightly closer spacing between 2 and 3 but no shorter than 2 years.

My kids are 27 months apart, we had our 1st was due 15 months after we got married (but was a month early) I was only 27, but my husband was 36 when we had our 1st, that is why we had them so quickly and so close together, He wanted to be done by the time he was 40 so we had them boom boom.  I thought mine were too close together until my sister had hers 17 months apart, but she was 36 when she had her 1st kid so SHE was old.  But we both stopped at two. I really wanted a 3rd eventually but hubby said he was to old so we stopped.  You talk about dealing with toddlers and babies at the same time.  Try having teenagers. My oldest graduated from high school yesterday and my youngest will do so in 2 years. The hormones the tempers it is a struggle, can you imagine having 19 of them  Granted they won't have the issues w/ friends or boyfriends/girlfriends that stuff, but somedays I cant wait until my daughter finishes school.  I long for a time where I come home to a quiet house, not needing to be anything other than just me, not mom, not running here or there, not cooking dinner cleaning up after kids. I can't imagine having to do this for 40 years.  They have already been doing it for 28 years and it will be another 12 years before Josie is 18. I'm exhausted after 18 years of doing this. 

[hapamama]

I had my first child about 3 weeks after my 21st birthday and had my last at 33. They are 23 months, 3 years 4 months, 3 years 1 month and 3 years 11 months apart. The morning sickness I had with the younger 4 was sufficiently awful enough that the thought of having a baby every year and a half is horrifying. 

[elliha]

50 minutes ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

My kids are 27 months apart, we had our 1st was due 15 months after we got married (but was a month early) I was only 27, but my husband was 36 when we had our 1st, that is why we had them so quickly and so close together, He wanted to be done by the time he was 40 so we had them boom boom.  I thought mine were too close together until my sister had hers 17 months apart, but she was 36 when she had her 1st kid so SHE was old.  But we both stopped at two. I really wanted a 3rd eventually but hubby said he was to old so we stopped.  You talk about dealing with toddlers and babies at the same time.  Try having teenagers. My oldest graduated from high school yesterday and my youngest will do so in 2 years. The hormones the tempers it is a struggle, can you imagine having 19 of them  Granted they won't have the issues w/ friends or boyfriends/girlfriends that stuff, but somedays I cant wait until my daughter finishes school.  I long for a time where I come home to a quiet house, not needing to be anything other than just me, not mom, not running here or there, not cooking dinner cleaning up after kids. I can't imagine having to do this for 40 years.  They have already been doing it for 28 years and it will be another 12 years before Josie is 18. I'm exhausted after 18 years of doing this. 

True, my sister's kids are grown and I remember in particular when the two boys (number 2 and 3) were in their teens. They were two years apart and very competitive towards each other and there was so much drama from the younger brother whenever he was not allowed to tag along or do something his older brother got to do, he more or less saw them as exactly the same age but there can (and it very much was in this case) be oceans of difference in development between say a 14 year old and a 16 year old. My sister only has her youngest still at home and she is a pretty calm teenager but I think she almost misses the drama, she promtly got two cavalier king charles spaniels when the older kids moved out. They are like having eternal toddlers running around making noise and needing supervision...

[BabyBottlePop]

10 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Yes. Kelly is actually much more fertile than Michelle in that she's had more pregnancies. Kelly had 23 while Michelle had 19. I'm including miscarriages. 

Michelle's had 21 pregnancies with Caleb and Jubilee. 

[catlady]

but Michelle has 2 sets of twins, so that's 17 pregnancies resulting in live births.

[marmalade]

Regarding Erin and potential size of brood, hasn't someone somewhere said that you can only do so many pregnancies with the heparin? I thought I read that there was a limit to how many times one could do this to the body. 

Anyone?

[anjulibai]

13 hours ago, catlady said:

but Michelle has 2 sets of twins, so that's 17 pregnancies resulting in live births.

Yeah, she's "only" been pregnant 19 times total. Kelly has been pregnant 23 times total. 

[habert]

Yeah, 19 single pregnancies vs 15 single pregnancies and 2 twin pregnancies is pretty much...the same

[Bushes of Love]

On 29/05/2016 at 1:20 AM, JesusCampSongs said:

So, at my age of 31, Kelly and Michelle both had 9 kids. 

There's not enough fuck that in the world for this. omg. My cat is plenty, thanks.

You and I are pretty much the same age (I'll be 31 in just under 2 months), I can't imagine having 1 kid now never mind 9 of the damn things!

I also have a cat as my fur baby and he gives me full on meltdowns. I'd be the worst mum ever!

[anjulibai]

Nevermind not worth arguing. 

[silverspoons]

 

 

13 hours ago, marmalade said:

Regarding Erin and potential size of brood, hasn't someone somewhere said that you can only do so many pregnancies with the heparin? I thought I read that there was a limit to how many times one could do this to the body. 

Anyone?

I had to take thinners during my pregnancy (lovenox not heparin, but basically the same thing). No one limited pregnancies but it wasn't recommended. My son had a teacher that had 7 kids and she had clotting factor and  did the shots so I know it is possible but not the norm. I went to "the" high risk clinic in Utah to have my kids. Obviously the majority of women were LDS and wanted big families. The majority of the women I met that had to take heparin or lovenox decided not to have as many kids as they planned or wanted I would say an average was 3 and that includes the first kid that many did not know they would need thinners till something went wrong so it was not a full pregnancy of shots for baby #1. I don't know who this Christian doctor is that helps Kelly and Erin but he is dying breed. The high risk LDS doctors would not be happy to see someone coming back time and time again , getting pregnant on purpose and in the state of Utah for all the babies born, there are limited options for ob/gyn's and high risk is very limited to a handful of doctors in 2 practices so there is no doctor shopping like Michelle .

All I can say is I would not want to go through the shots and pregnancies  that much. I have a clotting issue along with a uterine abnormality. I had many miscarriages and hate shots and the bruising from the shots is horrible. It just wears on you both emotionally and physically and it is hard to enjoy what you have when you are constantly sick or worried about another baby. My 2 kids are almost 5 years apart. I was happy my son was in full time preschool when I dealt with my difficult pregnancy with my daughter. I thought long and hard about having #3, 8 years after having my daughter. I just could not risk it. I just did not want to spend 8 months worrying about a pregnancy and not being available for my kids and then what if something happened to me? Dying in childbirth to fundie's might be some badge of honor but after seeing my MIL's life (her mom died in childbirth, a homebirth in front of my 5 year old MIL) it was another reason not to chance it.

Clotting issues also make birth control options harder. I have used NFP for 13 years. I have had no problems. I do have an incredible husband that has supported my choice and never complains when I say no on day 13. Erin or any of the Bates' or Duggar's using NFP just have to have an understanding spouse on board.

 

I think my MIL seeing her mom die in childbirth had the opposite effect. She had 13 biological kids with her husband (2 more but that is horrific story). She had a honeymoon baby and then went on birth control. When she stopped birth control and didn't get pregnant right away she freaked out and decided never to take it again. She breastfeed for about a year and got pregnant 3 months after stopping. It was  like clockwork, my husband's birthday week is shared with 5 siblings and it would be shared with 8, but her last 3 kids were born 2-3 weeks early. The next generations seem more fertile but luckily they use birth control. My MIL granddaughter's are crazy fertile. One had 3 kids in 26 months and another 4 kids in 40 months. The one that had 4 in 40 months actually gave baby #4 up for adoption. She was married but struggling. The could not even afford a car that could fit 4 kids. She got her tubes tied and the adoptive family helped pay for her to finish her degree. It also made all my SIL's and nieces be so careful with birth control.

[devoe364]

She had 13 kids by the time she was 34 (my age). I can barely take care of myself, my cat and a couple of house plants. Of course she just about had a mental break down. I would have had a mental breakdown. I would have made the laundry room incident look small.

When I think of Michelle's break down, I can't help but think of Andrea Yates. 

[Toothfairy]

So fundie women have competitons to see whose more fertile. What do they get if they win?

[habert]

6 hours ago, anjulibai said:

Nevermind not worth arguing. 

I mean I was agreeing with you so...yeah definitely not lmao

3 hours ago, Toothfairy said:

So fundie women have competitons to see whose more fertile. What do they get if they win?

Reverence in their social circle. Cults are pretty much the same everywhere unfortunately 

[anjulibai]

Sorry, I think I misunderstood what you were saying.