Lori Alexander- the Mindless Mentor: Part 8

[Leftitinmysnood]

One of my FB acquaintances posted Lori's "avoid gossiping" flowchart yesterday. She's not a homeschooler, but I'm not terribly surprised. I'd really like to see her explain her Outlander obsession to Lori, though. 

[SweetLaurel]

 Deep breath - dog stuff - get her spayed before her next heat cycle - why torment her?? I've done without a while now and it sucks.   They only WANT while they are in heat.  Why make her want?  I KNOW why I can't have it - they don't.  

  Do NOT take the dog on a 12 hour drive -  leave him elsewhere - take the new dog IN the house let new dog get used to being there and THEN bring old dog in.   I board in the house and always let boarding dog in an area first and then add old dogs. You can't throw a new dog into an established pack and have an easy time of it.   Works out much better if you add a dog to an area the new dog is already in.  

No, humping is not always a sign of dominance - its some times just a DAMN this feels good...  but it can be.  Dogs who hump or don' t - hey, all dogs aren't created equal...and it doesn't always mean the same thing... I have a boarding lab who is humping my couch cushions...    She's weird - but not at all dominant.  Just Feels Good...  

 Did I miss anything  - back to MS Lori who who is way harder to understand than dog behavior...

 

[eandre31]

4 hours ago, refugee said:

@eandre31 you mentioned that it's different with two spayed females. 

Our 2yo female (large, aggressive breed) is pretty submissive to us, though has shown aggression to an intruder. She's rather timid, actually, in a lot of ways. Even lets the cats eat and drink out of her bowls, which we try to discourage because this breed is known for food aggression, and backs off when the cats make clear they don't want to be messed with, when she wants to play.

*snipped*

So if we're planning to bring home an older animal that might be more dominant in personality, what do we do? Do we take our dog with us when we make the 12-hour drive to the kennel? (This would be pretty stressful for her.) Arrange for the potential housemates to meet?

Request a mellow dog looking for adoption, leave our dog at home, and have them meet at the local park when we get back into town?

Would a dog or a bitch be a better potential match? (That's assuming they have a dog ready to be adopted...)

I wouldn't say it's so different with females, just that in my experience (and many of my colleagues'), female dog pairs seem the most finicky with dog relationships. That doesn't mean it's uncommon for 2 girls to be civil or even best friends! I have had spayed female pairs and they have gotten along great. 

If your girl has shown aggression to intruders, it doesn't mean she will show aggression with other dogs. How does she get along with other dogs? Has she even been around other dogs? If she tends to be friendly with other dogs, I wouldn't worry too much. If the drive is too stressful, you can definitely bring the new one home to meet in a neutral area (a park like you mentioned). If she is known to be aggressive with other dogs, I would definitely talk to the breeder about a retired dog that he or she thinks would be a good fit for a domineering dog. If the breeder has a dog that is mellow and submissive with other dogs, that would probably be a better fit.

And of course make sure the breeder will take the new dog back if it doesn't work out. Having 2 dogs that hate each other in the same house is stressful and dangerous. It can be done, but it's not fun.

Done derailing the Lori thread now... I have to catch up on what I missed! Lol

[Koala]

Poor Lori...her thread now revolves around dogs. 

[refugee]

2 hours ago, dairyfreelife said:

God has put it in the hearts of little boys to want to grow up to be doctors, lawyers, builders, preachers, firemen and farmers.

Really? I think it's more a result of social pressure, actually.

I knew a little girl who earnestly declared her ambition to grow up to be a farmer and helicopter pilot, for instance. I know a husband and wife who are both nurses. (And darned good ones.) One of my elderly relatives used to reminisce about a woman he went to college with, who went on to become a respected pediatrician. A friend's hard-working, insightful, compassionate and knowledgeable oncologist is a woman.

I knew a guy who was a better "mom" to his kids than I was to mine.

I could go on and on.

1 hour ago, eandre31 said:

How does she get along with other dogs? Has she even been around other dogs? If she tends to be friendly with other dogs, I wouldn't worry too much.

Thanks for the info! 

She used to love to go to the dog park and play. We haven't been in awhile. The last time we went (she was still very much a puppy, at about 18 mos old) she got beat up by another dog when she picked up its ball, and had blood running down her face. She didn't start the fight, and she didn't continue the fight, just seemed really confused about why that other dog (half her size) was being so MEAN!

I don't know if she would be likely to fight now that she's grown (her breed supposedly takes two years to reach maturity). If the new dog is more "alpha" in personality maybe she'd just go along with it, even though she's been "top dog" (only dog) all her life. (Unless you count the cats. Then she's bottom of the pecking order.)

(oh, and breeder says they will always take back a dog)

[iheartchacos]

In other news, some women who follow LORIKEN are *really not ok* that those slutty Christian women who have remarried are allowed a second change at love when they are stuck in horrible marriages trying to be in submission in abusive relations...

It's funny that most of the women in the group have kids out of wedlock, are divorced, remarried, work away from home, etc...but they long to be this ideal woman Lori speaks of.

[quiversR4hunting]

@refugee one of my girls (preschooler) wants to be an FBI agent. When I say, you want to be a police officer, she says yes, an FBI officer. She is very specific.

Lori is horrible.

[Inthemadhouse]

I have two unneutered males, and they are both capable of controlling themselves around bitches, including those in heat.  If two animals can do it, any human being can.  It's not rocket science.

[Curious]

On 5/4/2016 at 4:47 PM, Koala said:

@feministxtian Do you mind me asking 3 questions?  Do/did the 2 male dogs do well together?  Had they been together since puppyhood? Were they neutered? (If so, was it before 7 months?)

Sorry...we're getting a new puppy, and I really want a boy.  Some people are saying you can't put 2 boys together, some are saying you can.  I am so confused.   

Hope it's okay that I asked.

I'd be way more worried about 2 bitches together than 2 males, especially if they are neutered.  At one point during the height of our rescue days, we had 10 dogs (a mix of boys/girls).  We had way more "bitch fights" (an actual thing in dogs) than we had problems with boys.    I do what is considered relatively late spaying/neutering (between 9-12 months) because I like them to be pretty close to full grown before they are fixed, it has never made any difference as far as I can tell.

Really it depends on the dogs themselves, not their gender.  If possible, your adult dog meeting the puppy and seeing how they do together is probably your best bet.

Humping is not a sex things with dogs (when they are doing it to dogs that aren't in heat).  It's a dominance thing mostly.   We had a papillon that would hump his special toy every night after he ate and our current papillon tries to hump one of the chis after he eats.   She is considerably smaller than he is so his hind end is about a foot away from her.  We just laugh at him and she kicks his ass when she's had enough of him bugging her.   One of our chis (all of who are female) humps any new puppy in the house almost immediately (we don't allow it when puppies are tiny.  Once they can tell her to knock it off we don't really police it that much).  She also humps the cats

[Curious]

I don't think we've discussed this woman before and this should probably be it's own thread, but the first thing that popped into my head when I was reading it was this will be Lori some day.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-06/belle-gibson-legal-action-to-be-taken-against-wellness-advocate/7390612

[molecule]

Today's post is the "how to be a good housewife" list from a 1950's home ec textbook that I've seen going around the past few years. Lori has a paragraph blaming feminism for removing the list (which is totally biblical, of course). Then she just types out the whole list and wraps it up with a Debi Pearl quotation. No image credit again, nor any indication of her source for the list. 

[smittykins]

I don't know if that's the one I'm thinking of, but I know at least one of those "1950s good housewife guides" was proven fake.

[Loveday]

Actually she left out a good bit of that list. The one I've seen comes from Housekeeping Monthly Magazine's May 13, 1955 issue (see, Lori, that's how you credit your source), and here's a more complete list:

1. Have dinner ready. Plan ahead, even the night before, to have a delicious meal ready, on time for his return. This is a way of letting him know that you have been thinking about him and are concerned about his needs.

2. Most men are hungry when they come home and the prospect of a good meal (especially his favorite dish) is part of the warm welcome needed.

3. Prepare yourself. Take 15 minutes to rest so you’ll be refreshed when he arrives. Touch up your makeup, put a ribbon in your hair and be fresh-looking. He has just been with a lot of work-weary people.

4. Be a little gay and a little more interesting for him. His boring day may need a lift and one of your duties is to provide it.

5. Clear away the clutter. Make one last trip through the main part of the house just before your husband arrives. Gather up schoolbooks, toys, paper, etc. and then run a dust cloth over the tables.

6. Over the cooler months of the year you should prepare and light a fire for him to unwind by. Your husband will feel he has reached a haven of rest and order, and it will give you a lift too. After all, catering for his comfort will provide you with immense personal satisfaction.

7. Prepare the children. Take a few minutes to wash the children’s hands and faces (if they are small), comb their hair and, if necessary, change their clothes.

8. Children are little treasures and he would like to see them playing the part. Minimize all noise. At the time of his arrival, eliminate all noise of the washer, dryer or vacuum. Try to encourage the children to be quiet.

9. Be happy to see him. Free him with a warm smile and show sincerity in your desire to please him. Listen to him.

10. You may have a dozen important things to tell him, but the moment of his arrival is not the time. Let him talk first — remember, his topics of conversation are more important than yours.

11. Make the evening his. Never complain if he comes home late or goes out to dinner, or other places of entertainment without you. Instead, try to understand his world of strain and pressure and his very real need to be at home and relax.

12. Your goal: Try to make sure your home is a place of peace, order and tranquility where you husband can renew himself in body and spirit.

13. Don’t greet him with complaints and problems.

14. Don’t complain if he’s late home for dinner or even if he stays out all night. Count this as minor compared to what he might have gone through that day.

15. Make him comfortable. Have him lean back in a comfortable chair or have him lie down in the bedroom. Have a cool or warm drink ready for him.

16. Arrange his pillow and offer to take off his shoes. Speak in a low, soothing and pleasant voice.

17. Don’t ask him questions about his actions or question his judgment of integrity. Remember, he is the master of the house and as such will always exercise his will with fairness and truthfulness. You have no right to question him.

18. A good wife always knows her place.

Either she knows that some of these are too problematic for even her most die-hard leg-humpers, or--more likely-- she's saving the rest for a future post. 

 

[kpmom]

28 minutes ago, Loveday said:

4. Be a little gay and a little more interesting for him. His boring day may need a lift and one of your duties is to provide it.

Yes, I expect being a little gay would spice up his boring day alright! 

I remember reading that this list was fake too, but honestly, though I'm not quite that old, I imagine similar advice was given in any and every 1950's magazine geared toward women.

[refugee]

Is this what sparked the rise of feminism? Getting advice from lists like this, that turn the average person (unless they're very *very* mellow and have a natural giving nature, so that they're always trying to give back as much as they receive) into little tin gods? Trying to follow the list, and feeling more and more downtrodden? ("Remember, *his* topics of conversation are more important than yours." "Remember, he is the master of the house and as such will always exercise his will with fairness and truthfulness. You have no right to question him." "A good wife always knows her place.")

I can't imagine who wrote this stuff in the first place. A henpecked husband, fantasizing about how he wished things should be?

I can't imagine a woman writing this list. And yet, I came out of a culture where the older women teach the younger women this exact mindset.

Talk about dehumanizing.

And my complementarian friends cannot understand why I find complementarianism so upsetting these days...

ETA: Suddenly the movie How to Murder Your Wife comes to mind. "Push the button...!" Except it was somehow backwards... Not awake/alert enough to examine the parallels or social implications of that movie's portrayal of the role of a wife, in comparison to the magazine list.

[docmom]

I'm apparently a pretty good 50s housewife despite actually not being a housewife at all!   I make dinner most nights and as I leave early and come back early (DH gets kids off to school and comes back later than I do) dinner is almost always ready for him when he comes in.  Because the kids go to ebil school and come home when I do, there is no clutter from their day around the house.  The kids are quiet because they're either doing their homework or frantically catching up on the electronic device stuff they missed while at their ebil after school activities.  They usually change out of uniforms as soon as they get home, too, so a check in that box, I think.  I am happy to see him when he gets home so that's another one checked.  Because I work most of my complaints of the day are work related and are generally worked out at work so I don't tend to complain as soon as DH enters the house.  I love fires in the winter here so often light one when I get home.

Not what I think Lori was really talking about, but it seems that having a working mother/wife is actually great for my husband.

[polecat]

2 hours ago, Loveday said:

1. Have dinner ready. Plan ahead, even the night before, to have a delicious meal ready, on time for his return. This is a way of letting him know that you have been thinking about him and are concerned about his needs.

 

Well, I've failed right off the bat.

My husband works nights, so if I had dinner waiting on the table for his arrival, he'd be annoyed. Instead, I have a full breakfast waiting for him when he walks through the door. I've never yet heard a complaint. But perhaps I should tell him Lori Alexander, Godly Mentor and Mouthpiece of the God of the Universe, has declared that he should have dinner when he comes home instead and that he should like it or lump it.

 

(I'll bet my homecooked breakfasts would knock the socks off anything Lori could ever make with her damned salads.)

[EyeQueue]

Wow. Miss me with this Victorian "Angel in the House" bullshit.

And that list reads like one that was debunked as a fake a couple of years ago by Snopes or someone else. I don't have time to use my Goggle Tactics (tm) since I'm headed off to work, but might do some digging later.

[ViolaSebastian]

59 minutes ago, EyeQueue said:

Wow. Miss me with this Victorian "Angel in the House" bullshit.

And that list reads like one that was debunked as a fake a couple of years ago by Snopes or someone else. I don't have time to use my Goggle Tactics (tm) since I'm headed off to work, but might do some digging later.

Hot dog, we have a weiner. The verdict: LEGEND.

http://www.snopes.com/history/document/goodwife.asp

[Loveday]

5 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Hot dog, we have a weiner. The verdict: LEGEND.

http://www.snopes.com/history/document/goodwife.asp

I suspected as much, considering that the person who originally posted the list on my FB newsfeed tends to post satirical stuff anyway.

Now, should we let Lori know it's fake? 

ETA: I just had a look, and Lori is now saying the list is from Debi Pearl's Created To Be His Helpmeet. No point in trying to convince her it's fake. Debi published it, so it must be real. 

[ViolaSebastian]

1 minute ago, Loveday said:

I suspected as much, considering that the person who originally posted the list on my FB newsfeed tends to post satirical stuff anyway.

Now, should we let Lori know it's fake? 

I would sort of love to see Ken ride in on his horse of truth and try to man-splain this one away...

[molecule]

Here is what Lori would likely say: It doesn't matter that it's fake. It's biblical, so even if it wasn't legit, it should have been and we still need to adopt it now.

[Florita]

I have two genuine textbooks used in marriage & family classes by the Milwaukee public schools in the 1950s. One has a copyright of 1950 and the other 1954.

There are NO how to make your husband happy lists. Both books teach that the ideal marriage is egalitarian. Both books support positive reinforcement as superior to corporal punishment for training children.

When wifely submission, patriarchy and "spare the rod" are discussed it is in the context of "back in our great-grandparents' day."

[iheartchacos]

Has Lori ever admitted she has been wrong? I'm amazed reading well thought out responses, from other Christian women, and her refusal to even consider a different interpretation. Why does she think her interpretation is the only valid one?

And I can. not. stand. her "THE BIBLE SAY MS NOTHING ABOUT..." argument. I just want to shake her.

[FundieFarmer]

On the FB page, Lori states:

God has put it in the hearts of little boys to want to grow up to be doctors, lawyers, builders, preachers, firemen and farmers. Likewise, He has put it in the hearts of our daughters to want to be mommies. 

When boys want to be daddies and girls want to be doctors, lawyers, builders, preachers, firewomen, farmers, engineers, computer scientists, CEOs, and much more, is that put into their hearts by Satan?

This comment

 I'm sorry, but when you put people into boxes like that you are putting God in a box, too, and you can't put God in a box. Who are you (the originators of this post) to say God has not put into the heart of my daughter to be a nurse, or my other daughter to be a speech therapist? Who are you to tell someone with the talent and desire that they can't or shouldn't be an artist, teacher, mail carrier, lawyer, law enforcement, etc., etc.? Whatever you do, do as unto the Lord--not "you can only do this and this for the Lord?" Not everyone fits your perfect mold, college is not for everyone, not all mothers do well full time at home, not everyone needs or wants to climb the corporate ladder. I was a stay at home mom because I knew I was not one who could go out to a job and then come home and care for my kids properly. Others can and should do so without feeling guilty if that is what they feel called to do. We Christians should STOP trying to make these perfect boxes and trying to stuff other people into these perfect boxes. That's what the Pharisees did. If someone is a true follower of Jesus, seeks Him daily, hourly, every minute, listens to and follows where Jesus leads, then who am I, or you, to say they are wrong and disobedient. The Pharisees said Jesus was disobedient to God because He healed on the Sabbath. Stop putting people into boxes. Stop putting God into boxes.

Of course Lori says:

If you have a problem with this, you will have to talk to the LORD about it.

and this:

He does tell us to judge those in the Church. The Proverbs 31 woman's entire life revolved around her home. She never had a career where she left her home all day and her children in the care of others. This is a modern day fallacy. Children need their mothers at home with them. Children are secure and emotionally stable with their mothers at home.

Another woman chimes in:

 I am questioning the reference you make to 1 Timothy 5:14 - this entire chapter is devoted to how the new church was to care for widows, elders and slaves. Verse 14 is not a blanket statement that all women should marry and bear children. Paul is instructing Timothy on how to care for the family of believers, young widows in particular.

Lori responds showing her inability to reason things:

Why would he give young widows different instructions than he would give any young women? 

Lori does not bother to respond to the lady's reply. 

Lori missed a lot of p31. Like surveying a field and buying it. Or buying the materials for her family's clothing. Or giving alms. Or...or...

Home came first, but that woman was not tethered to her home like Lori wants her minions to be.