Anna Duggar and the M kids part 6

[Shadoewolf]

People can change with the right motivation. Hubby and I spent from the beginning of April to October apart last year.  He's in recovery, had a bad relapse and one night I don't know what he took but he completely flipped out on me. Alot of bruises, a busted lip and a broken wrist, oh I swore I was done.  Suddenly I was a single mom to 3 kids (one of which has unique needs)  in a VERY small Arkansas town where his family knew everyone. I still managed to get a job, get my own apartment and get custody of our son. I had no support there but 2 friends who at times I swear saved my life and a lawyer through legal aid.

And while everyone says never stay with an abuser.....having a protective order where he couldn't see our son without supervision and only like 8 hours, one Saturday every month.  My oldest, who he's practically raised since she was 8 or 9 wanted nothing to do with him. The photos of my face and the bruises when presented in court, the fact it was pointed out that he stands a good foot taller than me and outweighs me by a solid 50lbs, the look on his family's face when they saw what he'd done.... was the kick in the ass he needed. He cleaned up, we started going to real counseling and we've been a lot better since.

Josh and Anna COULD fix it. But that would mean away from the TTH, out of the reach of JB&M's interference and influence, and throwing away their Gothard teachings and going to a licensed professional and committing to work at it. Couples' counseling is not his parents throwing Scripture at them. Problem is, they'll never do it. I feel for the M kids, as kids sense everything. And its like "At the Ballet" from A Chorus Line, "when I was born he came to the hospital and said, well I thought this was going to help, but I guess its not".  Kids know when there's a disconnect between people. Anna may follow "keep sweet" but if the kids see her cringe away when he tries to side hug her, or the coldness of a kiss on the cheek, they'll grow up the same way, knowing their dad doesn't love their mom and in their case, thinking its okay to stay.

[OrchidBlossom]

I feel sorry for Anna in a sense. I've used this metaphor before, but I see the Duggar kidults as being at the bottom of a very steep, difficult to climb hill. Their parents and elders put them there on purpose in an attempt to dissuade them from attempting to climb it. I feel bad for them, I can look at that situation and say "yeah, that really sucks. That is a difficult position you are in." But I can also say "but you better get climbing, here are some social resources that could help if you do decide to climb; if you decide to stay down there to the detriment of your children and also society at large (because of the toxic views they espouse) then don't expect much from me".

I guess basically I sympathize with her position, but not really with her choices.

[NeverAFundie]

Elizabeth Gilbert (of Eat, Pray, Love fame) posted this on Facebook not too long ago.  I think it speaks to what are transformative moments for people.  This phenomenon was very much part of my own decision to get out of an abusive relationship, but only because I had been raised in a way where I knew there were options.  It was possible for me to say NOT THIS.  My hope is that as time goes by, and the Duggar kids and kidults get more and more exposure to the outside world, that it will become incrementally easier for Anna (and anyone else) to see the options that could make them say NOT THIS.  Side note: I think this is the big reason behind the extreme isolation in Maxhell...Steve does not want any of his progeny to have even the remotest idea that NOT THIS is even a choice.

* * *
Dear Ones -

Most of us, at some point in our lives (unless we have done everything perfectly...which is: nobody) will have to face a terrible moment in which we realize that we have somehow ended up in the wrong place — or at least, in a very bad place.

Maybe we will have to admit that we are in the wrong job. Or the wrong relationship. With the wrong people around us. Living in the wrong neighborhood. Acting out on the wrong behaviors. Using the wrong substances. Pretending to believe things that we no longer believe. Pretending to be something we were never meant to be.

This moment of realization is seldom fun. In fact, it's usually terrifying.

I call this moment of realization: NOT THIS.

Because sometimes that's all you know, at such a moment.

All you know is: NOT THIS.

Sometimes that's all you CAN know.

All you know is that some deep life force within you is saying, NOT THIS, and it won't be silenced.

Your body is saying: "NOT THIS."

Your heart is saying: "NOT THIS."

Your soul is saying: "NOT THIS."

But your brain can't bring itself to say "NOT THIS", because that would cause a serious problem. The problem is: You don't have a Plan B in place. This is the only life you have. This is the only job you have. This is the only spouse you have. This is the only house you have. Your brain says, "It may not be great, but we have to put up with it, because there are no other options." You're not sure how you got here — to this place of THIS — but you sure as hell don't know how to get out...

So your brain says: "WE NEED TO KEEP PUTTING UP WITH THIS, BECAUSE THIS IS ALL WE HAVE."

But still, beating like a quiet drum, your body and your heart and your soul keep saying: NOT THIS...NOT THIS...NOT THIS.

I think some of the bravest people I have ever met were people who had the courage to say the words, "NOT THIS" outloud — even before they had an alternative plan.

People who walked out of bad situations without knowing if there was a better situation on the horizon.

People who looked at the life they were in, and they said, "I don't know what my life is supposed to be...but it's NOT THIS." And then they just...left.

I think my friend who walked out of a marriage after less than a year, and had to move back in with her mother (back into her childhood bedroom), and face the condemnation of the entire community while she slowly created a new life for herself. Everyone said, "If he's not good enough for you, who will be?" She didn't know. She didn't know anything about what her life would look like now. But it started with her saying: NOT THIS.

I think of my friend who took her three young children away from a toxic marriage, despite that fact that her husband supported her and the kids financially...and the four of them (this woman and her three children) all slept in one bed together in a tiny studio apartment for a few years, while she struggled to build a new life. She was poor, she was scared, she was alone. But she had to listen to the voices within her that said, NOT THIS.

I think of friends who walked out of jobs — with no job waiting for them. Because they said NOT THIS.

I think of friends who quit school, rather than keep pretending that they cared about this field of study anymore. And yes, they lost the scholarship. And yes, they ended up working at a fast food restaurant, while everyone else was getting degrees. And yes, it took them a while to figure out where to go next. But there was a relief at last in just surrendering to the holy, non-negotiable truth of NOT THIS.

I think of friends who bravely walked into AA meetings and just fell apart in front of a room full of total strangers, and said, NOT THIS.

I think of a friend who pulled her children out of Sunday School in the middle of church one Sunday because she'd had it with the judgment and self-righteousness of this particular church. Yes, it was her community. Yes, it was her tribe. But she physically couldn't be in that building anymore without feeling that she would explode. She didn't know where she was going, spiritually or within her community, but she said, NOT THIS. And walked out.

Rationally, it's crazy to abandon a perfectly good life (or at least a familiar life) in order to jump into a mystery. No sane person would advise you to make such a leap, with no Plan B in place. We are supposed to be careful. We are supposed to be prudent.

And yet....

And yet.

If you keep ignoring the voices within you that say NOT THIS, just because you don't know what to do, instead...you may end up stuck in NOT THIS forever.

You don't need to know where you are going to admit that where you are standing right now is wrong.

The bravest thing to say can be these two words.

What comes next?

I don't know. You don't know. Nobody knows. It might be worse. It might be better. But whatever it is...? It's NOT THIS.

[QuiverDance]

I shared that on facebook last week! I find Eat, Pray, Love to be annoyingly self indulgent, but the NOT THIS essay resonated with me in a big way.  

[NeverAFundie]

I am very much of the "take what you like and leave the rest" attitude when it comes to Elizabeth Gilbert.  Like you, I loved this and it spoke to me in a big way because of where I am in my life right now.

My hope for EVERY PERSON in the grip of Biblical patriarchy is that they can come to know that NOT THIS is an option.

[gustava]

On 4/29/2016 at 2:06 PM, OrchidBlossom said:

to support five kids

Did I miss something????? Is Anna confirmed preggo????

[Four is Enough]

2 minutes ago, gustava said:

Did I miss something????? Is Anna confirmed preggo????

Speculation bus stopping at your corner in ten... nine... eight... (  I believe someone is speculating_

[OrchidBlossom]

6 minutes ago, gustava said:

Did I miss something????? Is Anna confirmed preggo????

 

3 minutes ago, Four is Enough said:

Speculation bus stopping at your corner in ten... nine... eight... (  I believe someone is speculating_

Apologies friends, I just mistyped. Four*** kids and hopefully it stays that way!

[Four is Enough]

Just now, OrchidBlossom said:

 

Apologies friends, I just mistyped. Four*** kids and hopefully it stays that way!

Amen to that!!

 

[19 cats and counting]

As much as I want Anna to leave Josh, I highly doubt that will happen.

What I would like to see happen (years down the line).

One of the Lost Girls plans her escape and gets out a la Suze Keller.   Mack is often treated as if she's the 5th Lost Girl and I would assume is pretty close to them.  Hopefully escapee Lost Girl remains close to Mack and lets her see there's a way out besides marriage.

If Anna won't get out then at least her daughters need to see there's another way.

[nickelodeon]

1 hour ago, Four is Enough said:

Amen to that!!

 

This username & post synergy...!

[Sweet Fellowship]

Oh no. More speculation that Anna has a bun in the oven. I hope not. Please, no "redemption baby".

[Kjaerringa]

@librarychick......creamed rutabagas are usually boiled, diced, then put in a cream sauce, similar to what you might use for creamed corn, creamed spinach, or creamed peas. I like fresh ground pepper in the sauce, for sass. Maybe some nice carmelized yellow onion, too...nom nom. My Norwegian forbears would have used simply  cream or whole milk, after making a roux of  butter, flour, and salt. No other seasonings. Mashed are simply boiled, mashed with butter,  salt and pepper to taste. 

[tabitha2]

15 hours ago, Sweet Fellowship said:

Oh no. More speculation that Anna has a bun in the oven. I hope not. Please, no "redemption baby".

 

It will happen. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow but the baby making will get back on track  of that have no doubt.

[MakeItSo]

I really REALLY hope they don't think that another baby will make everything ok and back to normal again... I could see someone suggesting that to Anna in her circle. -__-

[tabitha2]

I don't think anyone has to Suggest this to Anna... Marriage to her is to be a forbearing helpmeet and breed children who will be warriors for Jesus.    

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, tabitha2 said:

I don't think anyone has to Suggest this to Anna... Marriage to her is to be a forbearing helpmeet and breed children who will be warriors for Jesus.    

While I think Josh and Anna do not need another baby,  I think Anna does feel that she needs to have another child as a sort of sign that her family is returning to "normal."  This is in addition to the "warriors for Jesus" stuff.  Babies in her culture are a measure of her marriage's success. And she probably has sad memories connected to her pregnancy with Meredith that she may want to replace with more recent, positive memories.

 

[nst]

2 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

While I think Josh and Anna do not need another baby,  I think Anna does feel that she needs to have another child as a sort of sign that her family is returning to "normal."  This is in addition to the "warriors for Jesus" stuff.  Babies in her culture are a measure of her marriage's success. And she probably has sad memories connected to her pregnancy with Meredith that she may want to replace with more recent, positive memories.

 

at least that is one good thing come out of Josh running away to rehab 

no words about babies coming out anna's mouth- at least about her wanting /needing another one 

[sillybeebo]

On March 15, 2016 at 0:58 PM, ksgranola1 said:

Aside from N.O. & LV,,Dc is another Sin City. All the cheating those senators & gov. mucky-mucks go into, I'm sure more than one took Josh aside & showed him some new tricks.

Dallas, which is within hour(s) of Big Sandy, has a wide variety of strip clubs! 

[IReallyAmHopewell]

My hope for Anna and the kids is that NO ONE will hire Joshy to speak about his "sin." That will help THEM move on even if poor Joshy doesn't get to make a buck off his time wrestling in the wilderness with hookers Satan. I still hope she'll throw him out and write a tell-all book about what was expected of her! Won't happen, so at least I hope Joshy has to shut up and go back to selling cars or eBay-ing junk or whatever.

Spoiler

 

 

[sillybeebo]

On March 18, 2016 at 1:11 PM, ksgranola1 said:

Unless, of course you know according to congress, "Women have a way to shut that whole thing down."

That was specifically Todd Akin who lost his election after that debacle. Richard Mourdock lost his election, too, after saying something similarly related a few days later.

[Sweet Fellowship]

On 03/05/2016 at 3:03 AM, EmCatlyn said:

While I think Josh and Anna do not need another baby,  I think Anna does feel that she needs to have another child as a sort of sign that her family is returning to "normal."  This is in addition to the "warriors for Jesus" stuff.  Babies in her culture are a measure of her marriage's success. And she probably has sad memories connected to her pregnancy with Meredith that she may want to replace with more recent, positive memories.

 

I sincerely hope that Anna won't come to resent Meredith for that very reason. I can't help but feel like she will be treated like Jordyn - pushed aside in favour of M5, the almighty redemption baby (in Jordyn's case, "miracle" Josie).

[tabitha2]

I get the feeling  Meredith is the one she has been mothering the most lately and The other 3 kids have been thrown, so to speak ,into the Lord of the Flies mass   that is lot of similar aged little Duggar kids.   

[ksgranola1]

And I don't think that's a bad thing. They are old enough, maybe not Markus, to notice when mommy is sad & sense something is wrong. Playing w/their cousins at least lent some normalcy to their lives.

When I clicked on Intouch or Us, one of those, they have these little side stories & pictures all around the man headline. One was a pic. of Anna & the print was, "Josh & Anna Duggar to seek professional couples counseling." When I went back to read the article it had rotated out to something else. I wasn't able to find it again. So there may be a lot more going on that we don't see. They would never admit to seeing a professional b/c it would mean the Gothard Way failed. And I think Anna is painfully aware of this failure

[patsymae]

8 minutes ago, ksgranola1 said:

And I don't think that's a bad thing. They are old enough, maybe not Markus, to notice when mommy is sad & sense something is wrong. Playing w/their cousins at least lent some normalcy to their lives.

When I clicked on Intouch or Us, one of those, they have these little side stories & pictures all around the man headline. One was a pic. of Anna & the print was, "Josh & Anna Duggar to seek professional couples counseling." When I went back to read the article it had rotated out to something else. I wasn't able to find it again. So there may be a lot more going on that we don't see. They would never admit to seeing a professional b/c it would mean the Gothard Way failed. And I think Anna is painfully aware of this failure

Alas, as the family follows the Pearl method of child raising, it's likely Anna was "counseled" according to the Debbie Pearl wisdom of marriage. For a while I really had hopes for her (DC, nicer clothes, "friends" and a library visit that were staged but at least she got to see them, but I was delusional. Just like I was about Derrick being someone who was of real use in Nepal and Jill having real midwife skills. I'm clearly too stupid to live.