Mandatory Fitness

[roddma]

Ugh I hated PE class in high school and luckily I only needed one credit in the late 1980s for teaching, though I didnt finish. I was never a very athletic person.
I also agree it seems intrusive and they should at least lower requirements for those with physical disabilities if it is mandatory.

[Curious]

10 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

I don't think that. I think that fat = eating more calories than your body need for a long period of time.

It's not always that cut and dried.  I am currently eating between 900-1000 calories per day.  Last week I lost 1/5 of a pound.

In that calorie amount, I have to balance carbs (due to a huge spike in my blood sugar for no apparent reason) and protein (which helps with wound healing), plus the normal required nutrients for good nutrition.

I'm not exactly sure what I could cut out that would allow me to lose weight and still get the required nutrition.

Also, right now I'm more active than I have been in over a year since I was finally allowed to go to physical therapy.

[OnceUponATime]

10 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

It's a private college, and there is no requirement to go to that particular college, or even college at all. 

Yes, Just like people work for private companies, are not forced to work for any particular company nor even actually work for a company. It doesn't mean that the private companies can do anything they want and you should just suck it up or leave. I think the same thing for schools. (I'm not saying this in relation to PE requirements, more in relation to possible privacy issues/forced biometrics).

Why didn't the college just say "with the advancement in technology we will now be accepting fitbit (and other like-devices) logging as a way to fulfill requirements for this course"? Something like that allows the student to say "hang on a minute, I don't want you having access to all my fitbit data and I would prefer to log all this shit manually". Problem solved.

I find PE requirements weird - my uni had a gym and we could get really cheap memberships to it. We had various sportsclubs that were for casual sport, ballroom dancing Thursday nights and other random 'exercise' oriented things. We just weren't required to do that in order to graduate. I didn't even know until this thread started that that was a thing in places.

 

[FundiesInParis]

10 hours ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

https://www.mormon.org/faq/law-of-health

Too many individual answers to c/p.  Y'all have at it.

@refugee  To my knowledge, chocolate is allowed.  Someone else may be better informed.

I believe they also do herbal teas, but not 100 percent on that, either.

Herbal tea's are fine, and I don't think caffeine has anything to do with it because the Mormons I know drink soda

[polecat]

13 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

I don't think that. I think that fat = eating more calories than your body need for a long period of time.

 

 

It's just not always that simple. 

I've mentioned before that I have a disease called lipedema. It is a condition in which my body ramps up fat production in response to inflammation, stress, hormonal changes, etc. I once packed on 50 lbs. in a matter of months in which I was highly stressed and barely eating at all (because I have a nervous, anxious stomach that does not handle stress well -- and by the end of that year, the weight gain was even higher). I have nearly 30" difference between my waist, which is a completely normal size, and my hips, which are plus, plus sized. My legs are so fat that it affects my gait, and therefore my ability to participate in certain exercises/activities. The only way to lose the fat on my legs, hips and arms (the only parts of my body that actually ARE fat), is through surgery to remove the fat. Many, many women with lipedema suffer from secondary obesity not because they eat too much for too long but because the lipedema makes it difficult to do anything, and you gradually become housebound and immobile.

But, you know, people still look at me, and they don't see my clearly visible collarbone or my dainty wrists or my small fingers ... they see my FAT, and they believe that , yeah, she eats too much, she's lazy, etc. In truth, I eat a healthier diet than the vast majority of people because I HAVE to to keep inflammation down and prevent the disease from worsening.

It'd be nice if people would just mind their own bodies. A disease like mine is painful enough (literally -- the fat accumulations HURT) without having other people stigmatize me for it. And before anyone says, "That's different. You have a health problem." No, that's the point -- no one knows enough about any stranger's health to say they're fat because they eat too much or move too little. 

[Whoosh]

12 minutes ago, polecat said:

It's just not always that simple. 

I've mentioned before that I have a disease called lipedema. It is a condition in which my body ramps up fat production in response to inflammation, stress, hormonal changes, etc. I once packed on 50 lbs. in a matter of months in which I was highly stressed and barely eating at all (because I have a nervous, anxious stomach that does not handle stress well -- and by the end of that year, the weight gain was even higher). I have nearly 30" difference between my waist, which is a completely normal size, and my hips, which are plus, plus sized. My legs are so fat that it affects my gait, and therefore my ability to participate in certain exercises/activities. The only way to lose the fat on my legs, hips and arms (the only parts of my body that actually ARE fat), is through surgery to remove the fat. Many, many women with lipedema suffer from secondary obesity not because they eat too much for too long but because the lipedema makes it difficult to do anything, and you gradually become housebound and immobile.

But, you know, people still look at me, and they don't see my clearly visible collarbone or my dainty wrists or my small fingers ... they see my FAT, and they believe that , yeah, she eats too much, she's lazy, etc. In truth, I eat a healthier diet than the vast majority of people because I HAVE to to keep inflammation down and prevent the disease from worsening.

It'd be nice if people would just mind their own bodies. A disease like mine is painful enough (literally -- the fat accumulations HURT) without having other people stigmatize me for it. And before anyone says, "That's different. You have a health problem." No, that's the point -- no one knows enough about any stranger's health to say they're fat because they eat too much or move too little. 

This is really well said.  I want to really emphasize the point that when people tell these stories it is usually not because they are "taking things personally" or having a pity party and asking everyone to come or whatever.  What I think people should take away from a story like this is the fact that the next person you see who has more fat on their body than seems ideal very well could have no way to change that.  There is already strong scientific evidence that this is the current reality for a subset of overweight people.  As science and technology improve it is likely that we will uncover basic truths about individual body functions that put more people into that category - not less.  Hopefully we will also discover ways to help people who have issues like these.  Time will tell.

[ViolaSebastian]

2 hours ago, FundiesInParis said:

Herbal tea's are fine, and I don't think caffeine has anything to do with it because the Mormons I know drink soda

IIRC, the Words of Wisdom outlines that you're not supposed to drink hot drinks, like coffee and tea, due to the high concentration of caffeine.  Sodas are more acceptable, and although Mormons are encouraged to avoid them, you can still drink them and be in good standing with the Church.  

Here's Donny Osmond's take on the whole matter: http://donny.com/my_beliefs/why-caffeine-not-allowed/

[Gossamer1]

On 2/5/2016 at 7:18 AM, Vex said:

. Students are adults who can make their own decisions 

No, they are not! They are large size 5 year olds who need to monitored every moment of the day.

[Grimalkin]

13 hours ago, meda said:

It is a private college, but (assuming they are an accredited college that can accept state and federal government student loans)  it's still subject to federal civil rights laws including the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA).  I am not seeing how a student with limited mobility could be legally be subject to the Fitbit requirement

I assume people with disabilities would be exempt. I think that goes without saying.

[SpoonfulOSugar]

I don't know this source well (so take it with a grain of salt) but given the quotation marks, I assume they asked the burning question:

http://www.newser.com/story/219965/university-makes-fitbits-mandatory.html

Provost Kathaleen Reid-Martinez tells Ars Technica that "if a student cannot physically wear a Fitbit, we'd comply with the [Americans With Disabilities Act] and work with that student to develop an alternate process," though it isn't an issue she has had to deal with.

A sports and health professor tells the Washington Postthat the previous pen-and-paper system for logging fitness levels was inaccurate and time-consuming, and the only griping he's heard about the Fitbits has been related to their $150 cost.

Here's the source article:

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/02/evangelical-university-requires-fitbit-ownership-data-syncing-for-freshmen/

Said article also delves into the data sharing issue.

Provost Kathaleen Reid-Martinez confirmed to Ars that participating students log into the Fitbit app and grant heart rate and steps tracking permission to an account affiliated with Oral Roberts—and no other tracking is required. 

Comments on both sites - some worth digging into.

So they don't use the GPS function, and the students are effectively granting permission for the access . . . .

 

[nausicaa]

The no coffee or tea thing for Mormons comes from Smith's "Word of Wisdom" which forbids "hot drinks." At the time all hot drinks had caffeine. There are three interpretations of what Smith meant:

1. No caffeine (and there are some Mormons who do not consume chocolate) but hot drinks w/o caffeine, like herbal teas, are fine. 

2. No hot drinks. So no herbal tea, but Pepsi is all right (I have several friends who follow this). 

3. No hot drinks OR caffeine. (I'm guessing BYU follows this policy.)

There is a lot of dissension in the church on this, and Mormons even make jokes about how everyone groans when someone brings it up at a church meeting because they know there's gonna be a three hour long discussion with no one getting anywhere. 

[Curious]

1 hour ago, nausicaa said:

The no coffee or tea thing for Mormons comes from Smith's "Word of Wisdom" which forbids "hot drinks." At the time all hot drinks had caffeine. There are three interpretations of what Smith meant:

1. No caffeine (and there are some Mormons who do not consume chocolate) but hot drinks w/o caffeine, like herbal teas, are fine. 

2. No hot drinks. So no herbal tea, but Pepsi is all right (I have several friends who follow this). 

3. No hot drinks OR caffeine. (I'm guessing BYU follows this policy.)

There is a lot of dissension in the church on this, and Mormons even make jokes about how everyone groans when someone brings it up at a church meeting because they know there's gonna be a three hour long discussion with no one getting anywhere. 

I suppose it makes sense that back then there was no iced tea/coffee and no decaf options.  I don't drink tea for the caffiene.  I like the taste.  I don't care if it's decaf or not, I can't tell the difference.  Both times I was pregnant I drank decaf and now I just buy whatever is on sale cause ice tea is ice tea.  I'm not a brand snob when it comes to tea.

I don't drink soda (or pop if you prefer) and I don't drink coffee.  I pretty much drink tea and water.   I do drink juice once in a while, but usually eat whole fruit rather than juice.

[SpoonfulOSugar]

5 minutes ago, Curious said:

ice tea is ice tea

Boy, are you delusional.

 

[Curious]

1 minute ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

Boy, are you delusional.

 

wait for it....you might want to sit down.  I'll wait.

 

 

 

 

 

I drink it unsweet too!

[SpoonfulOSugar]

Just now, Curious said:

wait for it....you might want to sit down.  I'll wait.

 

 

 

 

 

I drink it unsweet too!

I would list an inventory of the teas we have right now, but you don't have time to read it.

And as you might have guessed, I use a spoonful of sugar.

[Curious]

12 minutes ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

I would list an inventory of the teas we have right now, but you don't have time to read it.

And as you might have guessed, I use a spoonful of sugar.

I like some flavored tea when drinking hot tea, but mostly I just like plain old tea.  hot or cold.   I have a...futzy...palette (is that the right spelling?) 

[SpoonfulOSugar]

18 minutes ago, Curious said:

I like some flavored tea when drinking hot tea, but mostly I just like plain old tea.  hot or cold.   I have a...futzy...palette (is that the right spelling?) 

See, and I think there's differences even between things like Lipton and Red Rose.  We have loose Assam and Darjeeling, and then it just explodes from there.  I love chais, so we have a whole bunch of different blends.  We have rooibos (the red tea), a green tea that I like, and several blends with white teas.  It is literally an entire shelf in our pantry.  I would say I drink about 3/4 of them with milk.

When I was little, my family had Lipton for every day and Bigelow's Constant Comment for guests.  I ADORE Constant Comment - even now that I have a cornucopia of choices.

[Maggie Mae]

10 hours ago, Curious said:

It's not always that cut and dried.  I am currently eating between 900-1000 calories per day.  Last week I lost 1/5 of a pound.

In that calorie amount, I have to balance carbs (due to a huge spike in my blood sugar for no apparent reason) and protein (which helps with wound healing), plus the normal required nutrients for good nutrition.

I'm not exactly sure what I could cut out that would allow me to lose weight and still get the required nutrition.

Also, right now I'm more active than I have been in over a year since I was finally allowed to go to physical therapy.

It IS that simple. I'm not saying it's a bad thing or that it's easy to achieve if you are trying to lose weight. It's also not something that everyone should be striving to do. Just that the calorie calculations are pretty well known and studied. You can't create fat from nothing. There are health conditions that make it more difficult, and it's not always something that people want or can prioritize. 

I'm not going to comment on your calorie count, that's between you and your doctor.

 

My issue is with sedentary behavior, not fat people. Being sedentary is associated with increased risks of breast and colon cancers. And of those diagnosed, the sedentary people are 40% more likely to die. There are studies that show declines in brain function, increased risk of heart attack, stroke, etc. Less efficient immune systems, decreased muscle tone. And people who don't get any exercise are more likely to suffer from depression. There are some studies that are coming out now about how being inactive most of the day (say, 8 hours at a desk) is not offset by the gym for an hour or two. Hence, the all day activity tracking. According to these recent studies, it's better to keep moving - get up more often, take a walk, etc, that to just sit and then go to the gym.

I'm very glad to hear that you are more active and able to go to PT. 

 

[Maggie Mae]

1 hour ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

See, and I think there's differences even between things like Lipton and Red Rose.  We have loose Assam and Darjeeling, and then it just explodes from there.  I love chais, so we have a whole bunch of different blends.  We have rooibos (the red tea), a green tea that I like, and several blends with white teas.  It is literally an entire shelf in our pantry.  I would say I drink about 3/4 of them with milk.

When I was little, my family had Lipton for every day and Bigelow's Constant Comment for guests.  I ADORE Constant Comment - even now that I have a cornucopia of choices.

we have a specialty tea store (we get a lot of people who move here from Portland, OR) and it sells loose leaf tea and spices. They have prepackaged pouches and giant containers where you bring your own container in and have them put in the amount you want. SO MANY CHOICES.

I no longer know what people mean when they say "I like plain tea." Black tea? Breakfast Blend? Green Tea? Oolong? Chai? Herbal?

I tend to just drink Bigelow blends, btw, because I hate messing around with loose tea.  

[SpoonfulOSugar]

2 minutes ago, Maggie Mae said:

I tend to just drink Bigelow blends, btw, because I hate messing around with loose tea.  

So - I bought these iron-ready slips, and Mr. Spoon makes up bags and seals them for me . . . . .

https://www.mountainroseherbs.com/catalog/teas/accessories#product-1255

Spoiled?  No, not me.

[refugee]

19 minutes ago, Maggie Mae said:

It IS that simple. I'm not saying it's a bad thing or that it's easy to achieve if you are trying to lose weight. It's also not something that everyone should be striving to do. Just that the calorie calculations are pretty well known and studied. You can't create fat from nothing. There are health conditions that make it more difficult, and it's not always something that people want or can prioritize. 

I'm not going to comment on your calorie count, that's between you and your doctor.

 

My issue is with sedentary behavior, not fat people. Being sedentary is associated with increased risks of breast and colon cancers. And of those diagnosed, the sedentary people are 40% more likely to die. There are studies that show declines in brain function, increased risk of heart attack, stroke, etc. Less efficient immune systems, decreased muscle tone. And people who don't get any exercise are more likely to suffer from depression. There are some studies that are coming out now about how being inactive most of the day (say, 8 hours at a desk) is not offset by the gym for an hour or two. Hence, the all day activity tracking. According to these recent studies, it's better to keep moving - get up more often, take a walk, etc, that to just sit and then go to the gym.

I'm very glad to hear that you are more active and able to go to PT. 

 

How interesting.

However, I was never able to consistently lose weight and keep it off with calorie restriction alone. (Or exercise, for that matter. When I was bulemic, I used exercise to help control my body's response to the amount of food I craved, but not everyone can exercise. I'm way beyond running six miles a day, anymore. I'm lucky if my knees will sustain a mile walk these days.) CICO (calories in calories out) doesn't work for me, or for a bunch of people I associate with. You know what's funny? I eat a high-fat, moderate-protein, relatively low-carb (under 100g a day) diet because it has eased my arthritis from something crippling (think constant pain, even when lying down doing nothing) to mostly functional (I still have trouble with stairs).

Oddly enough, following this way of eating, I've found that I lost weight almost by accident the first year (40 lbs in a year) without tracking calories (I went back and figured out I was probably consuming 1500 calories a day, thereabout). Then when I started getting interested in the weight-loss results and deliberately restricted calories to 1200 a day, I stopped losing weight, even gained. I restricted again to 1000 calories a day. Same result. Then someone directed me to a couple of articles that talked about our body's metabolic "famine" response that can cause a person to lose slowly or even gain on as little as 800 calories a day, and that too few calories can cause metabolic problems in an obese person. I jogged my calories up to 1700-2000 a day, and have started losing again.

The biggest factor for me is carbs. I have to keep them under 100g a day, or my cravings (which, if not addressed, can progress to full-blown binge eating disorder) return and make me miserable.

The interesting thing to me is that when I eat high-fat (healthy saturated fats like coconut oil, avocado oil, duck fat, ghee or butter, olive oil -- *never* canola or safflower oil, sheesh, never realized how much damage those things do or how they contributed to my arthritis until I started doing this three years ago), I am never hungry. Never. I used to be hungry all the time. Now I have to be aware of my calorie intake for a different reason: I'm perfectly content on 600-800 calories in one day, but I make myself eat two or three times that amount because of that whole "famine" metabolism thing.

YMMV. I don't insist that it's the only way to go. I only took the time to type this out because it actually works for me, and others I know with auto-immune issues, and far better than balancing calories with exercise. CICO does not always work, it is not foolproof, and it is no guarantee. Everyone's body is a little different.

Isn't that one of the problems with fundies? That they believe in a cookie-cutter approach?

[kjmackin]

I'm actually live not to far from Oral Roberts and I find how they handle things a little off putting. There is so many strict aspects about the university that to me makes it sounds like prison sentence vs a learning experience that college should be.  I feel that PE shouldn't be graded because everyone has different levels of fitness and with what they comfortable with. I get with the requirements of PE but I don't think it should be more a credit a semester. The university is known for their high level of mentoring their students every move that it not unusual to come across one of their spies in the different locations around town.

 

 

This is my college experience:

Since the university I attended was very science based with a strong focus on engineering ( about 70-85% of the student body studies engineering @ one point) most of the student body were not the althelic type but 3 credits of PE courses were required no matter the major. At the school each PE class was a  half credit which meant the class usually lasted just half a semester as well and there was a vast amount of different classes one could take. Each course was also a past or fail based on attendance vs performances which was very nice. The other aspect of the campus was that the main campus clocked in under a mile and most of the buildings were connected or at least very close together so you wouldn't have to be outside for very long especially on the days were frost bite was likely to occur. The university also have several traditional events that was based on university wide drinking with the school providing the liquor in the past but sadly the liquor been replaced with kegs of root beer. Although one event on campus acholal is still allowed with depending on the student it's a week long bender while building snow statues. One of the school fight song was "No Beer in Heaven ". A fair amount of us students came from the very conflicted background on liquor; and tend to over due at least 2-4 times in college especially during the week of the snow statues which really makes me give massive side eye at how we treat acholal in the states because it encourages people to overdue it.

I'm actually live not to far from Oral Roberts and I find how they handle things a little off putting. There is so many strict aspects about the university that to me makes it sounds like prison sentence vs a learning experience that college should be.  I feel that PE shouldn't be graded because everyone has different levels of fitness and with what they comfortable with. I get with the requirements of PE but I don't think it should be more a credit a semester. The university is known for their high level of mentoring their students every move that it not unusual to come across one of their spies in the different locations around town.

 

 

This is my college experience:

Since the university I attended was very science based with a strong focus on engineering ( about 70-85% of the student body studies engineering @ one point) most of the student body were not the althelic type but 3 credits of PE courses were required no matter the major. At the school each PE class was a  half credit which meant the class usually lasted just half a semester as well and there was a vast amount of different classes one could take. Each course was also a past or fail based on attendance vs performances which was very nice. The other aspect of the campus was that the main campus clocked in under a mile and most of the buildings were connected or at least very close together so you wouldn't have to be outside for very long especially on the days were frost bite was likely to occur. The university also have several traditional events that was based on university wide drinking with the school providing the liquor in the past but sadly the liquor been replaced with kegs of root beer. Although one event on campus acholal is still allowed with depending on the student it's a week long bender while building snow statues. One of the school fight song was "No Beer in Heaven ". A fair amount of us students came from the very conflicted background on liquor; and tend to over due at least 2-4 times in college especially during the week of the snow statues which really makes me give massive side eye at how we treat acholal in the states because it encourages people to overdue it.

I'm actually live not to far from Oral Roberts and I find how they handle things a little off putting. There is so many strict aspects about the university that to me makes it sounds like prison sentence vs a learning experience that college should be.  I feel that PE shouldn't be graded because everyone has different levels of fitness and with what they comfortable with. I get with the requirements of PE but I don't think it should be more a credit a semester. The university is known for their high level of mentoring their students every move that it not unusual to come across one of their spies in the different locations around town.

 

 

This is my college experience:

Since the university I attended was very science based with a strong focus on engineering ( about 70-85% of the student body studies engineering @ one point) most of the student body were not the althelic type but 3 credits of PE courses were required no matter the major. At the school each PE class was a  half credit which meant the class usually lasted just half a semester as well and there was a vast amount of different classes one could take. Each course was also a past or fail based on attendance vs performances which was very nice. The other aspect of the campus was that the main campus clocked in under a mile and most of the buildings were connected or at least very close together so you wouldn't have to be outside for very long especially on the days were frost bite was likely to occur. The university also have several traditional events that was based on university wide drinking with the school providing the liquor in the past but sadly the liquor been replaced with kegs of root beer. Although one event on campus acholal is still allowed with depending on the student it's a week long bender while building snow statues. One of the school fight song was "No Beer in Heaven ". A fair amount of us students came from the very conflicted background on liquor; and tend to over due at least 2-4 times in college especially during the week of the snow statues which really makes me give massive side eye at how we treat acholal in the states because it encourages people to overdue it.

[Whoosh]

I have consulted with numerous doctors and CICO patently does NOT work for me.  We are currently experimenting with a variety of options and there is no clear indication that anything will work.  For the record, my disorder did cause a rapid weight gain in a very short period of time despite consistent diet and exercise regimes - but weight issues are not my problem.  A variety of other symptoms and issues are my problem.   As my illness has progressed, it has become clear that movement is the primary trigger for my symptoms.  It's a very shitty, limiting reality.  So, again, my medical team and I are trying to find a balance between a very sedentary lifestyle versus literally making myself extremely ill.  No one needs to believe me and people can have all the "problems" with that that they so choose.  It won't change my reality.

Judging people for having a sedentary lifestyle and/or assuming that they are not diligently monitoring the whole CICO thing under the supervision of a team of medical professionals is what it is.  Several people in this thread are sharing stories that indicate that a one-size-fits all approach harms at least some portion of society.  As I said earlier, as science and technology advance it is likely that more people will be recognized as belonging to that group.  I would totally agree that everyone should work with their doctor to determine what is best for their overall life and health.

[Dark Matters]

30 minutes ago, refugee said:

How interesting.

However, I was never able to consistently lose weight and keep it off with calorie restriction alone. (Or exercise, for that matter. When I was bulemic, I used exercise to help control my body's response to the amount of food I craved, but not everyone can exercise. I'm way beyond running six miles a day, anymore. I'm lucky if my knees will sustain a mile walk these days.) CICO (calories in calories out) doesn't work for me, or for a bunch of people I associate with. You know what's funny? I eat a high-fat, moderate-protein, relatively low-carb (under 100g a day) diet because it has eased my arthritis from something crippling (think constant pain, even when lying down doing nothing) to mostly functional (I still have trouble with stairs).

Oddly enough, following this way of eating, I've found that I lost weight almost by accident the first year (40 lbs in a year) without tracking calories (I went back and figured out I was probably consuming 1500 calories a day, thereabout). Then when I started getting interested in the weight-loss results and deliberately restricted calories to 1200 a day, I stopped losing weight, even gained. I restricted again to 1000 calories a day. Same result. Then someone directed me to a couple of articles that talked about our body's metabolic "famine" response that can cause a person to lose slowly or even gain on as little as 800 calories a day, and that too few calories can cause metabolic problems in an obese person. I jogged my calories up to 1700-2000 a day, and have started losing again.

The biggest factor for me is carbs. I have to keep them under 100g a day, or my cravings (which, if not addressed, can progress to full-blown binge eating disorder) return and make me miserable.

The interesting thing to me is that when I eat high-fat (healthy saturated fats like coconut oil, avocado oil, duck fat, ghee or butter, olive oil -- *never* canola or safflower oil, sheesh, never realized how much damage those things do or how they contributed to my arthritis until I started doing this three years ago), I am never hungry. Never. I used to be hungry all the time. Now I have to be aware of my calorie intake for a different reason: I'm perfectly content on 600-800 calories in one day, but I make myself eat two or three times that amount because of that whole "famine" metabolism thing.

YMMV. I don't insist that it's the only way to go. I only took the time to type this out because it actually works for me, and others I know with auto-immune issues, and far better than balancing calories with exercise. CICO does not always work, it is not foolproof, and it is no guarantee. Everyone's body is a little different.

Isn't that one of the problems with fundies? That they believe in a cookie-cutter approach?

I am similar in that I eat a high fat, low carb diet.  My carb count is under 30 grams a day and this is the only way I can lose weight.  Plus, my arthritis improved significantly, helping me go from needing a wheelchair all the time to now using a quad cane.  I still need the chair for anything that involves lots of standing or walking, like shopping, but for most of my daily activities the cane is enough.  Additionally, I am a T2 diabetic and my numbers on my blood work consistently run at normal levels since I started eating this way - been doing it for about 10 years so far.  Oh and by the way, I do very little exercise and still managed to lose over 200lbs so far.

[polecat]

 

1 hour ago, Maggie Mae said:

It IS that simple. I'm not saying it's a bad thing or that it's easy to achieve if you are trying to lose weight. It's also not something that everyone should be striving to do. Just that the calorie calculations are pretty well known and studied. You can't create fat from nothing. There are health conditions that make it more difficult, and it's not always something that people want or can prioritize. 

1

And again, it's really not. I have known women with anorexia and lipedema. Their legs are huge. Their torsos are skin stretched over bone because the lippy fat is gynoid fat (it also grows in the arms, and in later stages, the abdomen). Where did the fat come from? That was my question, too, because it made no sense to me how I can get fat even when not eating. As it turns out, lymph fluid is rich in nutrients, and in women with lipedema, the lymph pools around the fat cells, nourishing them, and it doesn't flow back out like it does in normal, healthy people. The lipedema fat cells are covered by hyaluronic acid and fibrotic tissue, which prevents them from being accessed for energy. So you gain fat even though you aren't overeating, and you cannot lose it. It's. A. Bitch.

There are other reasons a person may gain weight in spite of CICO, too, and as far as I'm concerned, that's between them and their doctor. 

I eat healthy (the RAD diet is extremely strict because it has to be), I exercise daily, I spend two hours and eight minutes every day hooked up to a lymph pump and I wear hot, itchy, heavy-duty compression garments 21 hours a day. Not to make it skinny -- but to keep it from getting worse. Don't take it personally? Then don't make it personal. My body is not public property, and no one has the right to make assumptions about it or anyone else's body, even when you *think* you know better.

This is my body, a body that is constantly decried, belittled and denigrated by society. How do I NOT take that personally?

If you want to dislike, be disgusted by, judge or outright hate fat people, that's fine. You do you. But own it. Don't try to hide it behind a flimsy facade of concern or pious "health" claims.