Growing Up Quiverful Kristina Miner - MERGED

[Bad Wolf]

The Pearls require instant obedience. (I heard a Dalek say that once.) So if a child hesitates, he gets the rod. He'd better do it with a smile, too. I think some people got hold of the book and used it without thinking. The answer to their prayers. So we got murdered children, and how many more who are suffering with the plumbing line and psychological torture. I can't imagine lying there wondering when the next blow will fall.

Maybe Josh picked up that if you're angry, then you're entitled to sex, and translated that into rough sex.

Pearl looks like the monster he is.

[iweartanktops]

The Pearls require instant obedience. (I heard a Dalek say that once.) So if a child hesitates, he gets the rod. He'd better do it with a smile, too. I think some people got hold of the book and used it without thinking. The answer to their prayers. So we got murdered children, and how many more who are suffering with the plumbing line and psychological torture. I can't imagine lying there wondering when the next blow will fall.

Maybe Josh picked up that if you're angry, then you're entitled to sex, and translated that into rough sex.

Pearl looks like the monster he is.

From the Pearl's book, TTUAC:

 

Try it yourself. Place an appealing object where they can reach it, maybe in a "No-no" corner or on an apple juice table (That's where the coffee table once sat). When they spy it and make a dive for it, in a calm voice say, "No, don't touch it." They will already be familiar with the "No," so they will pause, look at you in wonder and then turn around and grab it. Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, "No." Remember, you are not disciplining, you are training. One spat with a little switch is enough. They will again pull back their hand and consider the relationship between the object, their desire, the command and the little reinforcing pain. It may take several times, but if you are consistent, they will learn to consistently obey, even in your absence.

 

Bold is mine. Example of how they "train" for obedience. 

Here's where you can find the book online. Prepare yourself; it's heartbreaking. 

[MerryHappy]

Next time you see her give her a hug and tell her she's awesome for me! If that wouldn't be too weird.  

Will do! She should swing by here and talk to you all. I think you would really like her. 

[BullyJBG]

 

From the Pearl's book, TTUAC:

 

 

Bold is mine. Example of how they "train" for obedience. 

Here's where you can find the book online. Prepare yourself; it's heartbreaking. 

Using spanking as a form of training? THAT'S where it's abuse. Saying no is one thing, but isn't it best to re-direct their hand to where they should be? The "stop crying or I'll give you something to cry about" I heard that in my childhood and fought it tooth and nail(almost literally) once I had nails and knew that removing teeth was impossible. I was mixed between wanting to make my parents cry so I could show them how that doesn't work, or making them cry so I could show them "see, you cry, you can't help it, how does it feel now?" And yeah, I'm a firstborn too. Kristiana and I could have some good comparisons I'm sure. I look forward to her coming here and finding out more about how her family relationships are today; she said she had to cut off her parents but maintains relationships with her siblings. That's gotta be somewhat of a challenge if some still live at home.

[CreationMuseumSeasonPass]

As much as I think the 18 and older Duggan children are legally adults and can make their own decisions, I look at a video like this with a bright, intelligent woman who got to go to a state college, get a real job, marry a non-fundie husband, and I see how it was STILL so hard for her to break free of the cult. She is so lucky  authoritarian parents valued education, even with Gothard's misgivings against it. What I got from watching the video is ATI/IBLP not only takes everything in your life, it takes over the inside of your head. It's ingrained upon your every thought. What hope do those Duggars have? Kristiana, you have amazing strength!

[ArmchairTurnip]

As much as I think the 18 and older Duggan children are legally adults and can make their own decisions, I look at a video like this with a bright, intelligent woman who got to go to a state college, get a real job, marry a non-fundie husband, and I see how it was STILL so hard for her to break free of the cult.

I had the same thought.  When she talked about how her family life seemed normal to her until she saw it through her boyfriend's eyes, I got this sinking feeling in my stomach.  I'm sure that's at least half of what the courting ritual is about:  the parents' opportunity to vet the potential suitor to make sure they aren't going to unintentionally provide that moment of clarity. 

[EmCatlyn]

On the one hand, it's incredibly heartening to hear about people who have managed to get the hell out and find independence and happiness. I'm so glad that she seems to be in a good, happy place in her life now, though it came at a great personal cost.

On the other, this just makes me feel even more disheartened about the Duggars. Kristiana was so lucky to have parents who were willing to let her get a real education and socialize with people who weren't exactly like her. The Duggar girls have no such luck. Kristiana had the right ingredients for an escape; the Duggar girls really don't, and it will be much, much harder for them to do what Kristiana did.

The parents in this case (or at least the father) may have gone to college and therefore for them having an educated child was not threatening.  That is not the case with the Duggars.   Kristiana's parents also clearly prepared her well enough academically that she could do all right in college.  The Duggar homeschooling on the other hand . . .

Another important difference is that Kristiana's family only got into the Gothard cult when she was 12.  Before that they were Fundie and abusive but not a cult.  It is harder to question things when you have known nothing else all your life.  

Fascinating interview with this young woman who grew up in the Duggar's homeschool program, and shares her personal experience being raised just like the Duggars. It took her years to fully break free and do away with Gothard's belief system, though most of her family remain involved... This does give some hope that someday a few of the Duggar kids could break free too. 

Thanks for posting!

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

The parents in this case (or at least the father) may have gone to college and therefore for them having an educated child was not threatening.  That is not the case with the Duggars.   Kristiana's parents also clearly prepared her well enough academically that she could do all right in college.  The Duggar homeschooling on the other hand . . .

Another important difference is that Kristiana's family only got into the Gothard cult when she was 12.  Before that they were Fundie and abusive but not a cult.  It is harder to question things when you have known nothing else all your life.  

Not to mention, her parents had 6 years before she turned 18 in which to be "properly brainwashed." The Duggars started ATI before Josh was to start kindergarten, and they began the quiverfull movement between Josh and Jana/JD. They had a 17/18 years to be told about the horrors of public schooling, college, and any other form of education. 

[Timetostoplurking]

As much as I enjoy snarking on, laughing at and shaking my head in frustration at the Duggars, underneath all of that is THIS very serious side to their destructive life.  This interview reminds me how awful daily life must be for those kids/kidults.   The really sad part is that the Duggar kids don't even know how wierd they are.  I find them strangely fascinating and entertaining but it's really not funny....its sad....all of it....just sad!!  

This young lady is awesome and I hope her story inspires others to "fly free".   Fly little duggars, fly!    

[Drala]

I have known cult survivors, that is, young adults raised in high demand organizations who had very poor educations growing up, yet they broke free and eventually went to college.  One big difference between those survivors and the Duggar young adults is they were poor and desperate just to survive. They had to work if they wanted to eat, and this put them into contact with the evil world.  The Duggar kids are very comfortable, and they don't have to face the sobering realities of poverty.  They can thank TLC for that dubious blessing.

[BunnyBee]

knowing the endless skepticism of FJ'ers, and the utter shut down of believing that one kids AMA on reddit like a month ago, I am surprised I didn't see this comment yet:

FAKE SO FAKE, NEED PROOF, INTERNET TROLL, ANY ONE FROM THIS FORUM COULD REPRODUCE THESE ANSWERS, JUST WANTS ATTENTION, FAAKEEEKEKEKEKE

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

knowing the endless skepticism of FJ'ers, and the utter shut down of believing that one kids AMA on reddit like a month ago, I am surprised I didn't see this comment yet:

FAKE SO FAKE, NEED PROOF, INTERNET TROLL, ANY ONE FROM THIS FORUM COULD REPRODUCE THESE ANSWERS, JUST WANTS ATTENTION, FAAKEEEKEKEKEKE

what?

[RabbitKM]

I enjoyed the interview, and I really loved Kristiana's candidness and passion for speaking out.  I was a little surprised at how little research this interviewer did before sitting down with her, though.  I mean, if you are going to interview an ex-cult member, you should do some homework first.  But, in a sense, it made it a good interview because he had to ask her to clarify things that he didn't know/understand (like how Bill Gothard is connected to quiverfull, the Duggars, the Pearls, in one messy spiderweb of patriarchy).  

[EmCatlyn]

I enjoyed the interview, and I really loved Kristiana's candidness and passion for speaking out.  I was a little surprised at how little research this interviewer did before sitting down with her, though.  I mean, if you are going to interview an ex-cult member, you should do some homework first.  But, in a sense, it made it a good interview because he had to ask her to clarify things that he didn't know/understand (like how Bill Gothard is connected to quiverfull, the Duggars, the Pearls, in one messy spiderweb of patriarchy).  

I thought the questions were for the benefit of the audience, that the interviewer had an idea of the answers but was asking so that Kristiana would explain things the viewers might not know. But maybe you are right and he just hadn't done his homework. In any case, it was, as you say, a good interview.

[WhyNotJulie]

I spoke with Kristiana on Facebook briefly and she's such a wonderful and joyful person. She did say that she had some friends who managed to escape without going to college (maybe there's hope!).

Also, she said that she's lurked FJ a few times and saw the post sharing her interview. She's very happy that so many people are watching it and learning more about Gothard and his cult, and that she hopes that people who need to see it most might stumble across it!

[Jennifer Hart]

I loved this interview.  I can totally relate to going to college and still following rules.  I grew up in a strict household and even in college I only went to class, church activities and back to the dorm.  

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I thought the questions were for the benefit of the audience, that the interviewer had an idea of the answers but was asking so that Kristiana would explain things the viewers might not know. But maybe you are right and he just hadn't done his homework. In any case, it was, as you say, a good interview.

that's the impression I got as well. There were some things he had her clarify that he had touched on in the interview before hand, as well as revisiting things she had touched on before. I think it was more of a way to get her to explain to the audience, rather than for her to explain to him. Especially because the part before the interview included things he researched before the interview that I hadn't heard her talk about. 

[ShadowCat]

Thank you for posting this. It was eye-opening. It was interesting to hear how people found their way to Gothard. I have done some reading on it and on other similar cults, but to hear first hand how a family becomes indoctrinated is fascinating and scary. 

Agreed! Thank you so much for posting this.

Shock, but not surprise was my own reaction. I have read quite a bit on cultism, but to hear, and see it put out there in this manner... I think it's the easy conversational mode that got me.... is another thing altogether, and I find it increases my own understanding of Quiverfull and it's ilk.

It must be so difficult to get your head around another way of thinking after years of indoctrination. I can't even imagine how much fear and anxiety must be involved in doing so. I have nothing but admiration and respect for all of you who have turned your life around and began again.

[jqlgoblue]

For anyone who wants another great read / deep dive into the crazy from someone who has now left but is also incredibly scarred, there is a blog Hearesy in the Heartland by a woman named Jeri. It will take longer than 30 min. But worth the read. She goes into her days at Gothard HQ too.

[CreationMuseumSeasonPass]

As a news editor, I thought the interviewer did a good job because, in my business, I know you have to simplify your writing down to a sixth-grade level, because that's how the majority of your viewership will understand it best. Essentially, you dumb your writing down, even if it kills you. And, you have to clarify everything. If people start speaking in many acronyms, someone who is unfamiliar with the subject matter watching for the first time will become lost. As a person who has followed the Duggars and quiverfull for years, I understood everything Kristiana said right way and it was a little tedious for some repetition, but the journalist in me completely understood why the interviewer kept asking her to explain the background to her answers. That way, everybody goes away understanding 100 percent the same thing. Boom! Mission accomplished. No gray areas.

[iweartanktops]

Using spanking as a form of training? THAT'S where it's abuse. Saying no is one thing, but isn't it best to re-direct their hand to where they should be? The "stop crying or I'll give you something to cry about" I heard that in my childhood and fought it tooth and nail(almost literally) once I had nails and knew that removing teeth was impossible. I was mixed between wanting to make my parents cry so I could show them how that doesn't work, or making them cry so I could show them "see, you cry, you can't help it, how does it feel now?" And yeah, I'm a firstborn too. Kristiana and I could have some good comparisons I'm sure. I look forward to her coming here and finding out more about how her family relationships are today; she said she had to cut off her parents but maintains relationships with her siblings. That's gotta be somewhat of a challenge if some still live at home.

Not sure if you read my entire post or not, but I wasn't saying I agree with the Pearls. I was simply sharing what they wrote about obedience. I think it's disgusting and they belong in prison. 

[RosyDaisy]

I remember having blanket time with my sister's kids. I put a quilt on the floor with some toys and played with them. Add a frisky kitten to the mix, and it was hilarious! I couldn't imagine hitting or hurting them in any way. Neither could my sister. I'm glad those kids grew up knowing blanket time=fun, not pain and fear.

[Dollypeeps]

Michael Pearl may think he looks the part in a suit but he's the monster in the suit. 

I found his book online too and cried reading parts of it as I didn't know who he was years back as I was reading about the Duggars when they where 14 kids and counting. I found a parenting site now only open to members and Michelle was telling others to get rulers to smack the little kids with. Funny how when they get the series those comments vanished and that group circled the wagons and we were all liars. 

I'm glad kristina escaped and one salvation was that her parents wanted her to have a higher education. Sadly that will never happen for the Duggar adult children the now but I dream one day one by one they quietly drift away a from Gothardite teachings and give the bird to their parents. 

[quiversR4hunting]

For anyone who wants another great read / deep dive into the crazy from someone who has now left but is also incredibly scarred, there is a blog Hearesy in the Heartland by a woman named Jeri. It will take longer than 30 min. But worth the read. She goes into her days at Gothard HQ too.

I started reading her blog after someone mentioned her on here.  I highly recommend her blog

[IreneIssh]

Michael Pearl may think he looks the part in a suit but he's the monster in the suit. 

I found his book online too and cried reading parts of it as I didn't know who he was years back as I was reading about the Duggars when they where 14 kids and counting. I found a parenting site now only open to members and Michelle was telling others to get rulers to smack the little kids with. Funny how when they get the series those comments vanished and that group circled the wagons and we were all liars. 

I'm glad kristina escaped and one salvation was that her parents wanted her to have a higher education. Sadly that will never happen for the Duggar adult children the now but I dream one day one by one they quietly drift away a from Gothardite teachings and give the bird to their parents. 

Wait, Michelle was on a parenting website back in the day? Was she on there openly as Michelle Duggar?