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Real Life Fundie Encounters - Part 3


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Today's argument with fundies: 

 

Will someone please tell me why the hell fundies think people born with same sex attraction are in sin from childhood are in sin. because" God doesn't make any mistakes with babies he created." But if a baby is born with a birth defect or syndrome or something else it's all "oh we are living in  fallen world and this is the by product of it." 

 

Wouldnt being born SSA, by their logic, also be a result of a fallen broken world?

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Well - this is a timely bump to the thread.

Facebook just suggested this as a friend.  I know some of you will be Severely amused.  For those not aware, I am a degree or two removed from Sarah Maly thanks to my involvement in Bright Lights over 3 years ago.  591b6ae59d8ae_peopleyoumayknow.JPG.81f7dd90d458dbb2e119b70dd91ec1a1.JPG

 

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1 hour ago, EowynW said:

Today's argument with fundies: 

 

Will someone please tell me why the hell fundies think people born with same sex attraction are in sin from childhood are in sin. because" God doesn't make any mistakes with babies he created." But if a baby is born with a birth defect or syndrome or something else it's all "oh we are living in  fallen world and this is the by product of it." 

 

Wouldnt being born SSA, by their logic, also be a result of a fallen broken world?

The way it was taught to me in the '60s & '70s in conservative but not fundamentalist C was, Those with SSA are only in sin if they act on it. 

 

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20 minutes ago, MamaJunebug said:

The way it was taught to me in the '60s & '70s in conservative but not fundamentalist C was, Those with SSA are only in sin if they act on it. 

 

That's what I was taught too. But today I ran into fundies who literally believe that the attraction itself is a sin too. 

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1 hour ago, EowynW said:

That's what I was taught too. But today I ran into fundies who literally believe that the attraction itself is a sin too. 

My word.

We *are* headed to hell in a knockoff Coach handbag filled with baggies of Cheerios.

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I wonder how those who believe "He created them male and female" explain intersex babies?

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That's what I was taught too. But today I ran into fundies who literally believe that the attraction itself is a sin too. 

 

My old church taught that acting on the attraction was the sinful part. But then when the youth pastor (a man married to a woman) said he battled SSA and wanted to start a small group to help others in the congregation who might be struggling, aaaaand then they threw him out of the church. Even though he was literally the textbook example of what they advocated for. Jerks.

 

ETA I think that church's stance on SSA is wrong. When I said jerks I meant the hypocrisy of throwing the pastor out when he was following what the church taught.

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1 hour ago, ak1188 said:

 

My old church taught that acting on the attraction was the sinful part.

I just have to share something I was reminded of.  My old church/school (the one where I would dance in front of the flames if it ever caught on fire), had a senior pastor and a junior pastor.  Senior pastor was father in law of junior pastor.  Junior pastor's kid, the beloved grandson, came racing out of the closet when he was 18.  Senior pastor and his wife wanted the kid ostracized from the family until he mended his ways, so to speak.  While junior pastor and his wife wanted to support their son and love him, even though they admittedly didn't really accept or get the gay thing.  This MESS caused a complete split not only in the church, but in the family itself with FIL and wife, and SIL and wife ceasing contact with each other.  Even when the FIL died, he had left explicit instructions that he did not want to be buried in the family cemetery.   Just a little more compassion, and a little less pride would have saved a family years of grief.

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My ex posted this on his "church" FB page (public page):
"I'm excited about teaching this in a small group setting, and I need you guys to let me know if you would be interested, and what evening would be better for you. (Saturday afternoon/evening, Sunday evening, Monday or Tuesday evening). It is six sessions of approximately 60-90 minutes each, and suggested donation is $10 for the entire course. (This is for materials).
This covers Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormonism, Islam, Eastern religions and new age, as well as how to lovingly share the Gospel with each group. It would be excellent for the teenager as well as adult, the teacher and the student.
This is open to all, even if you go to another church. My calling is not only to lead people to Christ, but also to edifying the body through teaching of the Word. Even better, I want to train others to be strong leaders and teachers. Message or call me, or leave a comment and I will get in touch with you.
I know there have been a good number of you who have liked our page recently and live near here . Please feel free to get in touch with us! You are certainly welcome to come for the class. We would love to meet and fellowship with you."

The book he's teaching from is this:

Spoiler

18424026_1305431552905438_4994128259050047448_n.jpg.f0792aa7cd66364c6fe1d535112f6c5f.jpg

He should add a few lessons on people who set up their own churches, preach to an almost empty room for over an hour each Sunday, & livestream it on FB. 
Right now the only people who come to the Church of the Holy Singlewide are his wife, her two kids, his niece (so sis can have a free babysitter), and his father-in-law, who may or may not be a KKK member & is racist as fuck.  
The idea for this study started because they bought the book for their homeschool curriculum, & he thought it was so could he should share it with his FB "congregation." Dumbass, no one is going to pay $10 to come to your creepy trailer church.


So, he's teaching his stepkids that all other religions are cults. He thinks Catholicism is a cult, too, and that Jews must accept Jesus as their lord & saviour or burn in hell. He's seriously said before that the Holocaust was sad because of all the "unsaved" Jews dying and going to hell. This may or may not be one of the many and varied reasons we are divorced. 

Meanwhile, I'm studying the origins of various religions this week in my world history class, for my BA in history. Christianity is lumped in there with all the rest. He'd flip his wig. Secular liberal university for the win! 

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Your ex and my ex sound a lot alike!

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My late husband had a copy of Kingdom of the Cults, which was written by a Baptist minister and covers much of the same territory(I believe there was a chapter on SDA, which he decided wasn't a cult).

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This happened a few years ago, I was at an ice cream place in a rural area near where I live and one of the families in the FEW circle got there about 10 minutes before I left.

Edited by choralcrusader8613
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On 5/18/2017 at 4:51 PM, MamaJunebug said:
[mention=24772]SwimmerBoy29[/mention], welcome -- what is FEW?

The family that I saw is in the same little circle thing as the Staddon's, Wilkes, etc., the FEW is that conference thing they have every spring and since I didn't know what else to call it I just called it the FEW circle.

Edited by choralcrusader8613
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I was on my way to the Grand Canyon last week and saw a tour van called A Different Look or something to that effect. It was a creationist view tour of the Canyon. Sounds like something my ex would have made me do if I told him I wanted to go to the Grand Canyon.

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My father, sister, oldest brother (by his first wife and she is the one who converted him) and his family are all JW's to varying degrees. Dad and sister riiight into it. Door knocking and all. Love them dearly, very close but thankfully my fallen catholic mother (in her own words) wouldnt allow me to be brainwashed. Yes they are divorced and yes i am an atheist. Did you know that being rude to them or dismissive wont have any affect? They are taught to ne embarrassed for YOU, the godless heathen. A very hypocritical and condescending religion that one. #whowillsaaaveyoursoul 

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I saw a fundie grandmother and two granddaughters in the local dollar store today.  Everyone was dressed in a long denim jumper over a t shirt, hair pinned up, and clunky shoes.  Gramma was in an electric scooter.  Kids were very quiet, didn't talk, and jumped when Gramma spoke.

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On 5/19/2017 at 1:03 PM, PumaLover said:

I was on my way to the Grand Canyon last week and saw a tour van called A Different Look or something to that effect. It was a creationist view tour of the Canyon. Sounds like something my ex would have made me do if I told him I wanted to go to the Grand Canyon.

I was at the store once on the North Rim when I literally bumped into an entire family of Fundies. Long dresses, long hair, on the girls and polo shirts and khaki on the boys. I almost said isn't science great? Look at all those geologic layers of stone showing how many ages have gone by. But I didn't. My daughter would have kicked me. I almost asked if they had been to the Meteor Crater down the road from Flagstaff. That's supposed to be 50,000 years old. 

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I was at the store once on the North Rim when I literally bumped into an entire family of Fundies. Long dresses, long hair, on the girls and polo shirts and khaki on the boys. I almost said isn't science great? Look at all those geologic layers of stone showing how many ages have gone by. But I didn't. My daughter would have kicked me. I almost asked if they had been to the Meteor Crater down the road from Flagstaff. That's supposed to be 50,000 years old. 

Hahaha, I like you! That would have been funny.
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My coworker is a young male fundamentalist (not Christian). His religion forbids him from having any physical contact with women outside of his family (including a handshake in a business setting) and also from any socializing with women outside of his family.  Business related conversations with women are supposedly allowed, but he still avoids them.  He will not ask me questions - even those directly related to our work. He always directs his questions to our male coworker, even when I'm more qualified to answer them.

He speaks to our male coworker socially (about his family, how he spent his weekend, etc.). He does not speak to me. He doesn't say hello when he arrives in the morning.  He doesn't attend department or company meetings.  When he does attend small meetings, he stares at the floor and only speaks to women when spoken to directly and about business.  He does not make eye contact when walking down the hallway.  We find that we have to explain to people from other departments so they don't think he's just being rude. 

I am the only female in this department and the situation is becoming unbearable for me.  Our group used to be friendly and open.  But from what little information I can find on the subject, his freedom to practice his religion takes precedence over my right to not feel discriminated against at work because I happen to be female (we're in the US).  But still, I can't help but wonder what the company's stance would be if his religion forbade him from talking to/interacting with a person of color, or a person who practices a different religion. 

My only hope at this point is that our management will take action with his chronic lateness and absences.  It may or may not have anything to do with his religion, but he's burning through all his vacation and sick time allotment. I am starting to think that he believes he will not be fired because the company fears a discrimination lawsuit.

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6 minutes ago, LavenderSquare said:

My only hope at this point is that our management will take action with his chronic lateness and absences.  It may or may not have anything to do with his religion, but he's burning through all his vacation and sick time allotment. I am starting to think that he believes he will not be fired because the company fears a discrimination lawsuit.

I don't think he would win. If he's chronically late or absent all the time he can't claim religion and get away with it. Sorry but you need to do your job. I would complain. He IS being rude. 

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It's possible for men of certain religions to practice their faith and not be rude. There are several Muslim engineers and architects on our various projects. They work with women every day and manage to talk to us. (It's actually nice to have a work conversation with a man who looks me in the eye, rather than constantly glancing at my breasts.)
The only thing they don't do is shake hands, hug, or sit right next to a woman (they leave a chair between if there's no other way, but usually everyone is used to it & makes sure they sit between other men). Maybe I'm just lucky & they're nice guys. I imagine some fundie Christian men take it to the extreme, too. (Steve Maxell cough cough)
A couple of them are Middle Eastern, a couple are Indian or Pakistani. 

Edited by FeministShrew
sticking keys, ugh
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two sets of fundie relatives (who bought houses when they first got married) went off on how buying a house officially meant you were adulting and how awful and useless it is to throw money away by renting. 

 In front of Mr. EW & I who have no debt at all, are faithfully meeting our rent and all bills, are responsible with our money and pretty rental and are trying to get a game plan together to save and buy in a couple of years. 

 

I guess we aren't adulting well. 

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@EowynW don't feel bad. Mr. Shrew & I have both been there, done that, and we don't ever want to own a house again (possibly a condo one day, but that's doubtful). We like apartment living- no yard work, no exterior maintenance, and if there's a problem we can call the maintenance guys. Plus a big pool we don't have to maintain. 
 

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