Josiah Duggar Part 4

[happy atheist]

I have no idea what's been going on with this boy since his courtship ended in a million tiny heart fragments. I'm sure some kind user will post a recap for us.

Part 1: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=25619

Part 2: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=25696

Part 3: http://www.freejinger.org/topic/23787-josiah-duggar-part-3-now-with-lost-heart-pieces/?page=1

[ClaraOswin]

I don't think there's really anything new with Josiah. Other than his ex is apparently writing a book about love.

[HarleyQuinn]

Recap: After his likely Jim Bob pushed courtship with a possible fame hungry teenage girl ended, Josiah has taken to asking for donations on his Duggar Studios Youtube page. Then he switched to selling over priced t-shirts instead after backlash, then he tried to sell a used drone on ebay.  So basically he's spending his time learning to grift/beg money from fans.

[Bad Wolf]

Recap: After his likely Jim Bob pushed courtship with a possible fame hungry teenage girl ended, Josiah has taken to asking for donations on his Duggar Studios Youtube page. Then he switched to selling over priced t-shirts instead after backlash, then he tried to sell a used drone on ebay.  So basically he's spending his time learning to grift/beg money from fans.

It's always good to have a career.

[Valerie3kids]

Following in the family's footsteps.....

[SportsgalAnnie]

He was one I had hope for

[HarleyQuinn]

He was one I had hope for

Same.   I almost felt personally slighted. OT: This stupid "hi" emoticon won't go away. Omg

[SportsgalAnnie]

Same.   I almost felt personally slighted. OT: This stupid "hi" emoticon won't go away. Omg

He,Jinger and Joy were the ones I thought were most likely to run.

[roddma]

Here are young adults basically doing nothing all day but the fans prise them for their 'work ethic' and 'values'. .

[JillyO]

Carrying over this quote from @isarhenne from the last thread:

I had to keep my name when I got married because my wife was born with a hyphenated name (which was still possible in the 80's), so I couln't hyphenate mine with her's. Besides that, not changing your last name or hyphenating last names when you get married is really really really frowned up on in Germany. It was en vogue in the 70's but now when a women hyphenates her name she is immediately put in the category "condescending b****", and called a "feminist". And the word feminist in Germany is one of the worst things you can call a women there. I don't know how it got such a negative connotation...A lot of times women themselves say " I hate feminists!".

My wife (with her hyphenated name) is constastly called out at work for it. Before she married me they told her to look for a man with a nice simple short last name so she can change it. But guess what, she also kept her name and is proud of it because it's so rare to be born with it. Plus it's a nice conversation starter; the look in people's faces is always priceless.

My wife and I are the only women I know who did not change their last name when they got married. I get weird looks when I get asked: "How was your wedding?" "It was great , thank you!" "So, what is your last name now?" "Oh, I kept my maiden name" "What??!!!??? And your husband still wanted to marry you (most people assume that I have a husband)".

 

And for children it's easy: The who has to go through labor can give the child her last name! Easy and simple.

Wow. You and I must run in very different circles in Germany. Pretty much all of my friends and acquaintances, male and female, proudly call themselves feminists (obviously, some of them are more vocal about it than others, but if you asked them, almost everyone would say "Of course I'm a feminist. I believe that men and women are equals."). I haven't heard the term "feminist" used as an insult in... pretty much always. Maybe in the 90s? I don't know, I was a kid then.

As for changing last names... I would say it's pretty much exactly the same as in many places in the U.S. as described in this thread. The majority of women probably still change their last names to their husbands', but hyphenating (for her, him, both), the man changing his name to the wife's or each keeping their name is also pretty common (and, I would assume, becoming more so). My MIL changed her last name to her first husband's (she didn't like her birth name), then kept that last name (because she really liked it) when she married the second and third time (she's on husband number three). Her kids (with husband number two) also have the last name of first husband. No biggie. My FIL kept his last name during his marriage with MIL, but hyphenated with his second wife (she just kept hers). Again, no biggie.

Sooo, basically, I just wanted to say that my experiences are very, very different from yours. I'm guessing neither your nor my experience are representative for Germany as a whole.

[sj3339sta]

I still think there is hope some of them are going to jet.  Well, walk away slowly vs. running away in some dramatic fashion.  I just don't think it is going to happen until after they are done being such a public family.  If there is hope they can go back to the status quo, they will.  It won't be until that has completely dried up that things are going to change.  They will have to change if they are going to afford their current lifestyle.

[isarhenne]

Carrying over this quote from @isarhenne from the last thread:

Wow. You and I must run in very different circles in Germany. Pretty much all of my friends and acquaintances, male and female, proudly call themselves feminists (obviously, some of them are more vocal about it than others, but if you asked them, almost everyone would say "Of course I'm a feminist. I believe that men and women are equals."). I haven't heard the term "feminist" used as an insult in... pretty much always. Maybe in the 90s? I don't know, I was a kid then.

As for changing last names... I would say it's pretty much exactly the same as in many places in the U.S. as described in this thread. The majority of women probably still change their last names to their husbands', but hyphenating (for her, him, both), the man changing his name to the wife's or each keeping their name is also pretty common (and, I would assume, becoming more so). My MIL changed her last name to her first husband's (she didn't like her birth name), then kept that last name (because she really liked it) when she married the second and third time (she's on husband number three). Her kids (with husband number two) also have the last name of first husband. No biggie. My FIL kept his last name during his marriage with MIL, but hyphenated with his second wife (she just kept hers). Again, no biggie.

Sooo, basically, I just wanted to say that my experiences are very, very different from yours. I'm guessing neither your nor my experience are representative for Germany as a whole.

Really?! I' geniunely surprised by that! How old are you (is it ok if I asked you that?) and where do you live in Germany (south? east?) I'm 31 and live in the south (but was born in East Germany). Are you working or still very young? I have never met a german woman in my life who called herself a feminist openly. It's all hush hush. And most women I met would never consider themselves feminists even in secret. A lot of men in my environment would make jokes about women who believe in women's rights, I'm not kidding. And these are all university educated people with middle class backgrounds (or upper class). I have felt for years and years that me and my wife are the only feminists we know in real life. Maybe we should move where you live, haha...

 

[Trynn]

My co worker had an argument with another co worker over her name. My friends name is J hyphenated-name. And the co worker was insisting she was "J name."

Friend kept responding and arguing that no, her name was hyphenated (from birth, not marriage. We're talking the last name she was born with, which isn't even something she can control.)

The co worker didn't seem to comprehend that she was " an hyphenated last name."

I finally stepped in and told the co worker to shut the fuck up and stop telling people what their name should be.

[anjulibai]

Neither my husband nor I changed our last names when we married. On our marriage annoucements (we eloped), we even mentioned it. We then hyphenated our names for our son's last name, and let people know this via announcement. When I mail something from our family, I always write "The Mylastname-Hislastnames" or "The Mylastname-Hislastname Family". Heck, it's even up on Facebook for all of our relatives and friends to see.

Despite being married 6 and half years and our son being almost 4, people still send things to us addressed to "The Hislastname Family" or to "Son Hislastname". 

I just don't get it. It's not that hard to remember. One of the primary means of communication I have with most people (FB) lists name real name on it. I remember that they changed their names - how do they not remember that I did not change mine? 

The only person that consistently remembers is my sister-in-law, who thought it was the coolest thing ever my husband and I hyphenated our son's last name. 

[twinmama]

Doesn't really have to do with Josiah anymore, but I wonder whether Marjorie was fame hungry and when J no longer had a show she hit the road, or if her parents shut it down after the whole Josh thing (or the whole Josh things!) came out? I don't really want to believe that a girl that young would be SO fame hungry that she'd sign up for marrying someone, and be that shallow to ditch it all once he wasn't super famous anymore.

[JenniferJuniper]

Doesn't really have to do with Josiah anymore, but I wonder whether Marjorie was fame hungry and when J no longer had a show she hit the road, or if her parents shut it down after the whole Josh thing (or the whole Josh things!) came out? I don't really want to believe that a girl that young would be SO fame hungry that she'd sign up for marrying someone, and be that shallow to ditch it all once he wasn't super famous anymore.

She did come across as overly theatrical in the little bit we saw of her, but I lean towards her parents convincing her to pull the plug.   I don't know how fundie they are, but if they are semi-sane they probably had misgivings in the first place and when they learned the oldest son and golden boy molested his little sisters, they must have realized the Duggars are not what they seem.  And of course, no show meant no income for Josiah.

We'll probably never know the whole truth though. 

[Screamapillar]

Maybe Josiah's relationship with Marjorie is the most real thing we've seen from the Duggars so far: a couple of teenagers hung out for a couple of months and then broke up. Good on both of them for not feeling pressured to continue the thing all the way to the alter if one or both of them wasn't feeling it. Note to Jim Bob and Michelle: it is experiences like "giving away a piece of your heart" that actually enable your children to learn and mature! 

[EmCatlyn]

Maybe Josiah's relationship with Marjorie is the most real thing we've seen from the Duggars so far: a couple of teenagers hung out for a couple of months and then broke up. Good on both of them for not feeling pressured to continue the thing all the way to the alter if one or both of them wasn't feeling it. Note to Jim Bob and Michelle: it is experiences like "giving away a piece of your heart" that actually enable your children to learn and mature! 

"Without a hurt, the heart is hollow." (From the lyrics of "Try to Remember," from the 1960s musical, The Fantasticks.)

[sophie10130]

I went to a lot of youth groups in my day and sure, most of them did the same shtick with giving pieces of your heart away, but I did have one youth group who said that dating was the way of becoming more perfect for your future spouse. Both boys and girls got this talk, which I found refreshing. So you date and you're immature, but you learn to be better and with each relationship you get better at being in a relationship. With each new person you learn what you like and don't like and what you need from your significant other and how to be a better significant other. After dating and learning all of these things, you then become the best match for your future spouse.

Obviously, they also espoused sexual purity, but I wonder if this was their way to try to combat divorce. They were a (pretty) liberal non-denom church.

This makes so much more sense to me. I think about how I was when I was the age that these folks are getting married (and it wasn't long ago, just a few years) and how horrible I must have been to date. And I got dumped and I dumped and grew and learned about myself that ended up helping me be in such a rational, love-filled, mature, happy marriage today where I know what I need, I can express it in a way that doesn't make either of us upset, and we work towards that goal. There's no way in hell I could have done that even 5 years ago.

[busdrivingmom]

I have a hyphenated last name.  It was a compromise when I got married ( I was known in my field and DH was known in his and his mom threw a hissy fit I wasn't taking their name) plus my parents are not the fastest on getting things updated so we thought it might be slightly easier if something happened to them and I still kept my maiden name.  My current work only uses my married name for most paperwork cause it is easier to pronounce ( I switched fields over a year ago) but my computer login is under my maiden name.  My kids have DH last name.  

My family and my in-laws do not refer to me by hyphenated name its always Mr and Mrs Married name.  For the first couple years of marriage, I refused to open anything from DH or my family that was only addressed to me as married name.  I know its snotty but I really viewed it as disrespect after we explained the name situation to almost everyone and they said oh yeah we get it.  

[Coldwinterskies]

Neither my husband nor I changed our last names when we married. On our marriage annoucements (we eloped), we even mentioned it. We then hyphenated our names for our son's last name, and let people know this via announcement. When I mail something from our family, I always write "The Mylastname-Hislastnames" or "The Mylastname-Hislastname Family". Heck, it's even up on Facebook for all of our relatives and friends to see.

Despite being married 6 and half years and our son being almost 4, people still send things to us addressed to "The Hislastname Family" or to "Son Hislastname". 

I just don't get it. It's not that hard to remember. One of the primary means of communication I have with most people (FB) lists name real name on it. I remember that they changed their names - how do they not remember that I did not change mine? 

The only person that consistently remembers is my sister-in-law, who thought it was the coolest thing ever my husband and I hyphenated our son's last name. 

I've had the same exact experience. I did not change my name when I married, yet elderly relatives frequently address letters to me as "Mrs. Husband's Last Name".  It is weird to me. The idea of women choosing not to change their last name is NOT new - my own mother chose not to change her last name when she married my father. It doesn't really matter to me, but it is just baffling that some people are so set in their ways they would keep sending mail to the wrong name when they can see my correct name on Facebook. 

[singsingsing]

You don't have to date a bunch of different people to learn and grow as a person, to discover what you like and dislike, or to be a good partner. Yes, for some people it can be helpful, and that's awesome, but I think it's just as destructive to tell young people, 'You have to date a bunch of different people before you'll be good enough/smart enough/experienced enough to get married' as it is to promote insane courtship/purity restrictions.

[sophie10130]

maybe i explained it poorly. they didn't say you have to be a serial dater. they just said dating is okay and healthy and can be a good thing because you learn new things with each partner. it was different than many of my other churches that really wanted you to marry the first dude you dated.

[nastyhobbitses]

maybe i explained it poorly. they didn't say you have to be a serial dater. they just said dating is okay and healthy and can be a good thing because you learn new things with each partner. it was different than many of my other churches that really wanted you to marry the first dude you dated.

I like to think of it like this: some people find one car they like right away and know that they want to drive that car forever and ever. So they buy it and are happy. Other people have to shop around, take lots of cars for test drives, maybe rent or lease a couple, maybe even buy a car and realize it's just not the right car for them. Either way, the end goal is to find the best car for you. And if you decide that you'd rather just have a bicycle or walk, that's OK too! Now, going to the car dealership without much knowledge of driving cars or what you need or want to do when you drive a car, and just buying the first car you lay eyes on without a test drive or any knowledge of how the car works might not work out so well. And if you spend so much time just test-driving car after car without committing, that won't work out so well either. Know yourself, know the car, and you'll drive home happy.

[JillyO]

Really?! I' geniunely surprised by that! How old are you (is it ok if I asked you that?) and where do you live in Germany (south? east?) I'm 31 and live in the south (but was born in East Germany). Are you working or still very young? I have never met a german woman in my life who called herself a feminist openly. It's all hush hush. And most women I met would never consider themselves feminists even in secret. A lot of men in my environment would make jokes about women who believe in women's rights, I'm not kidding. And these are all university educated people with middle class backgrounds (or upper class). I have felt for years and years that me and my wife are the only feminists we know in real life. Maybe we should move where you live, haha...

 

Of course it's okay to ask! I'm 25. I just finished grad school about a year ago, so I've only really been in the work force since then. I live in Berlin, which is probably a big part of the reason you and I have had such different experiences. My in-laws are in Hamburg, which I'm assuming is much closer to Berlin than to where you're living, experience-wise. Otherwise, your background doesn't sound all that different from mine (most people are university educated, middle-class-ish). I am originally from a small-ish town in south-western Germany, and things are a little different there. But still, everyone I know back there definitely believes in women's rights/equality, and everyone is open and vocal about it. People there might not label themselves 'feminists' quite as often as here, but they basically all still believe in the tenets. I'm kind of dumbfounded by your experiences. I don't know that I would want to live surrounded by people who think I don't have the same rights as a man. That shit is scary. Hugs to you!