Benessa, Jinger, and the Chick Tracts

[Buzzard]

My husband has gotten a couple. He was so tempting to go put that in a Church offering plate.

I got one at a funeral I went to two years ago. I left it in the bathroom.

This thread has taken an exceptionally deep and awesome turn. Carry on, my theological discussions recently have been sincerely lacking. I love this stuff!

I wonder what Bin would think if he knew that his bs spewed an online discussion regarding the differences between religious foundations. Oh wait, he thinks "Arminian" refers to an ethnicity, but only after he asked Derick.

[Cleopatra7]

Wonder how they'd feel if they were handed a card from an other faith. Condemning their beliefs and foretelling of eternity in the fires of hell unless they convert. Would they see it as offensive and arrogant?

I don't think the Duggars are really aware that other religions exist, aside from Judaism (which they only know through the Bible) and Islam (which they only know from right-wing talking points). I seriously doubt that Jinger or any of the Duggars could explain what Jews and Muslims actually believe. They probably non-Abrahamic faiths like Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Shintoism, etc. as pagan idolatry.

[HarleyQuinn]

I am convinced that story she told about giving out a tract and the guy wanting more for his friends was him making fun of them/her. I wonder how many conversations they have/tracts they give out where they think the person is really into it but its just a laugh.

That's exactly what I thought too. They way she said he asked for more, it sounded like he was doing so to pull a prank on his friends, not to convert them. And it's sad Jinger is so sheltered she probably couldn't tell the difference.

[Buzzard]

That's exactly what I thought too. They way she said he asked for more, it sounded like he was doing so to pull a prank on his friends, not to convert them. And it's sad Jinger is so sheltered she probably couldn't tell the difference.

I always ask them for more. If they're talking to me they're not bothering anyone else.

[Emme]

I always ask them for more. If they're talking to me they're not bothering anyone else.

You are a good soul.

[CaroMoon]

That video made me so sad. Jinger was always my favorite; that spark of rebellion behind her eyes and her artsy style and interests. I could be in denial, but to me still it didn't seem like Jinger bought it. She just seemed extremely robotic, like she was reading cue cards. I feel bad seeing how much guilt and shame she has on her shoulders (which is why this form of christianity is so fucked) ... I still have hope, but its becoming smaller. I wish one of us could be a secret FJ agent and go in and save her, hug her, tell her its okay that she won't burn... and then we go out for drinks in NYC after.

I literally wanted to punch Bin this whole video. God I can't stand that kid.

[whateverwhoever]

I have been given some tracts a few times (one was amazing and basically just said that homosexulaotyand is "inconvenient" so god doesn't like it) and had someone come and try to talk me about Jesus. He told me I need a friend, and I told him I have lots if friends...the conversation went on for a while but he didn't seem to understand that I know about Jesus but just don't believe any of it.

[Nic]

Maybe Im just being hopeful, but did you notice a slight pause and ug gotta say this line... when asked about children and sin? I forget exactly what he said but the upshot after that awkwardish pause, yes those cute little ankle biters are full of sin.

But for a fleeting moment it really did look like he was uncomfy with what he was about to say...

[shedemei]

I have been given some tracts a few times (one was amazing and basically just said that homosexulaotyand is "inconvenient" so god doesn't like it)

Homosexuality? Homosexual toy land? :)

[Furslippers15]

That video made me so sad. Jinger was always my favorite; that spark of rebellion behind her eyes and her artsy style and interests. I could be in denial, but to me still it didn't seem like Jinger bought it. She just seemed extremely robotic, like she was reading cue cards. I feel bad seeing how much guilt and shame she has on her shoulders (which is why this form of christianity is so fucked) ... I still have hope, but its becoming smaller. I wish one of us could be a secret FJ agent and go in and save her, hug her, tell her its okay that she won't burn... and then we go out for drinks in NYC after.

I literally wanted to punch Bin this whole video. God I can't stand that kid.

My mind just can't understand why at least one child has pulled the curtain to see life outside of the compound. Curiosity of and questioning of faith about the world at large is human. They dress modern and stylish so clearly they are looking at some real world websites.

I'd love to have a look at Bens Facebook before he became involved with the Duggers. Did he preach sermons and use the fundie buzz words? If anyone has seen pre-Jessa Facebook please share.

[zz22zz]

Anyone think there is any chance they made this video to mess with the world? Like someone mentioned early in the thread it is interesting they chose Jinger as the first to give her testimony.

Jinger sounded eerily like Anna and Pris in their RV testimony video, which made me think parroting or messing with us.

Wouldn't it be amazing, though I know unlikely, if Ben and Jessa are just messing with everyone. Posting as crazy stuff as they can think of (yes their ideas would be limited because of their background) in the pursuit of what will cause JB and Jchelle (or Ben's parents even) to say "okay now that is too extreme!"

It all started with that sensual kissing pic....where they will go in attempt to shock, no one knows!

I know I may be just a dreamer, but am I the only one?

[eri]

Ben makes this "free gift" sound like an ebook you can get by signing up to some newsletter.. Also Ben would never convince anyone to convert. None of this sounds appealing. Does this shit actually work?

"this says 'are you a good person'? and the answer is no" Yeah, lead with that. Children (and their parents) must LOVE that.

When they claim they aren't good people it is obvious that is not what they truly think of themselves. They know they are better than everyone else, and acting humble is even more of an ego boost.

I don't think the Duggars are really aware that other religions exist, aside from Judaism (which they only know through the Bible) and Islam (which they only know from right-wing talking points). I seriously doubt that Jinger or any of the Duggars could explain what Jews and Muslims actually believe. They probably non-Abrahamic faiths like Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Shintoism, etc. as pagan idolatry.

It is funny because neolithic religions predate even Judaism by thousands of years. Judaism is by no means the oldest religion, which pokes a huge hole in the Biblical timeline and makes me think that it is all BS. There is no accepted proof of Moses' writing, and the earliest accepted hypothetical date of the Torah is 900BC. Meaning the well-established Egyptian and Indian civilizations (and therefore Egyptian religion and Vedic religion) predate Judaism severely.

You mean to tell me God let people go ignorant and unsaved for millennia? Biblical literalism rubs me the wrong way.

[whateverwhoever]

Homosexuality? Homosexual toy land? :)

Grrr my phone was being super glitchy but I thought I caught them all!! Haha guess not.

[BrownieMomma]

I just want to jump back to the topic of children and being saved.

I was taught, as a Southern Baptist, there is an age of accountability. There is, however, no specific age but in a general range from 7 - 12. By twelve, it is assumed that most people can understand right from wrong.

A child who dies before reaching an understanding of accountability goes to Heaven. No need for infant baptism, a practice ardently preached against. Heathen Catholics.

There was never, ever any talk of predestination except the occasional sermon on Revelation and then the focus was on what kind of millenialist (sp) are you. End times was terrifying stuff to me.

I never experienced any kind of Calvinist or Arminian thinking or preaching in an SBC church, or in any of the non-denom churches I attended afterward. I always heard that every person can be saved and go to Heaven, nary a whiff of an idea that only a few are already chosen.

[FJismyheadship]

Two things: ROPE through the eye of a needle makes a lot more sense than a camel.

FJ came to be in 2005 or 2006 Jinger would have been 11 or 12.

She was 14 in the drivers license episode of 17 kids, which was the season she was more prominent, when every one really started paying attention to her (becAuse she was a normal teen) so that could be, the popularity of being the rebel might have pushed her to get saved.

[Cleopatra7]

I think in the kind of religious subculture that Jinger grew up in that "getting saved" is simply something that one does around the tween and teenage years. There must be a lot of pressure on kids to "get saved" to make sure they don't go to hell and potentially be separated from their families. Although believer's baptism is supposed to ensure that people make an informed decision to became Christian, it seems more likely that young children are being scared into making religious commitments through gory depictions of hell or simply because they observe that other children are "getting saved" so they might as well too. If one of the Duggar kids didn't "get saved" by sixteen or so, I think JB and Michelle would worry about them (to the extent that the Duggar parents think about their kids as individuals, anyway).

[kimberm]

So is this Bins path to becoming a "preacher"? Bring his sister in law into one of his ministry videos for her testimony or whatever the heck it's called? These people just disgust the hell out if me more and more everyday.

So damn sad but they must have fundie kool aid pipped into the faucets. I sadly think none of the Duggar kids will ever escape. Maybe one of the list girls as the older kids will be too busy with their own quivers to remember them. Michelle and boob will be too busy with eleventy grand babies to remember them

[DefraudedByPlaid]

The only version of the Bible I trust as a legit translation is the Aramaic-to-English one. They have a better idea of how things were translated; for example, the old word for 'camel' is written similarly to 'rope,' as in the quote "It is easier for a rope to enter the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven." Whenever people quote the camel version I almost have to roll my eyes because it is clear they never bothered to look up something that makes no sense. I've heard made-up reasons for why it should be camel but they are the most unlikely.

Aramaic translation rocks. Just do it, folks.

*Accidentally wrote Armenian

Is one of those explanations you've heard about how "needle" is actually referring to some kind of low gate into a city? I've heard that back in the day, camels sometimes entered cities through these low gates called "needles" and had to lower to their knees to get through (and have all the packs on their backs taken off). The implication being that it's not impossible for a rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven, but it's challenging.

Also, could you tell me the name of a good Aramaic to English translation of the Bible? I haven't heard of that and am intrigued.

[Rachel333]

Most kids who grew up in my pretty conservative churches with me were baptised by 10 or so. It was actually somewhat rare for longtime church members to make it to high school age without being baptized. Jinger might have been talking more about having a "spiritual awakening" kind of moment vs. necessarily being baptized?

I agree she was probably talking about a spiritual awakening moment as 14 would be really late to be "saved." I was saved at about 2 or 3--I don't remember it but my mom says I understood and asked to be saved and then prayed the sinner's prayer--and that age is pretty typical, with baptism coming a bit later (I think I was 12, and that was kind of late). If you were saved young, though, your testimony typically includes a time in your teens of a spiritual awakening a re-dedication experience. It's hard to have an interesting testimony when you were raised Christian!

[SassyPants]

My mind just can't understand why at least one child has pulled the curtain to see life outside of the compound. Curiosity of and questioning of faith about the world at large is human. They dress modern and stylish so clearly they are looking at some real world websites.

I'd love to have a look at Bens Facebook before he became involved with the Duggers. Did he preach sermons and use the fundie buzz words? If anyone has seen pre-Jessa Facebook please share.

I think that besides the purity gig, JB and M basically ignore the older kids. They don't leave because they are pretty much on easy street compared to earlier times. I'd say that the kids have signed their money over to the Duggar Trust and JB doles it out. Apparently it's easier than having to get up before the sun and bust hump all day, everyday, at some crappy job where they'd have to answer to someone else. Most of the kids go to homeschool now and isn't an outsider (a Querry) doing that task? If so, that really gives the adult girls a lot of free time to do whatever the Hell they want. JB and M are too busy and too ABSENT both physically and mentally, to be concerned with the day in and day out operations.

[Nic]

My mind just can't understand why at least one child has pulled the curtain to see life outside of the compound. Curiosity of and questioning of faith about the world at large is human. They dress modern and stylish so clearly they are looking at some real world websites.

I'd love to have a look at Bens Facebook before he became involved with the Duggers. Did he preach sermons and use the fundie buzz words? If anyone has seen pre-Jessa Facebook please share.

But aren't they taught to fight the urge of questioning it? Isn't that temptation creeping in trying to trick them and lead them astray? My guess is if they have any questioning thoughts they are supposed to go back to the Bible and pray on it or ask JB to set them straight.

[SharonYvonne]

"Going to hell" is the default mode in this flavor of Christianity. I'm actually not being snarky here, and fundies will tell you the same.

Raised fundie here, and I can definitely attest to this!

[ariel9]

I don't have a problem with people accepting Jesus in their life but I do have an issue with legalism. You don't have to court, forsake a career, or have elevently babies to be a Christian. It's a sad that people rattle off such a longer than normal list of things that would scare people to hell.

[VixenToast]

Anyone think there is any chance they made this video to mess with the world? Like someone mentioned early in the thread it is interesting they chose Jinger as the first to give her testimony.

Jinger sounded eerily like Anna and Pris in their RV testimony video, which made me think parroting or messing with us.

Wouldn't it be amazing, though I know unlikely, if Ben and Jessa are just messing with everyone. Posting as crazy stuff as they can think of (yes their ideas would be limited because of their background) in the pursuit of what will cause JB and Jchelle (or Ben's parents even) to say "okay now that is too extreme!"

It all started with that sensual kissing pic....where they will go in attempt to shock, no one knows!

I know I may be just a dreamer, but am I the only one?

No they aren't doing this to yank our chains. They've gotta evangelize and Living Waters is just pimping sponsoring them to capitalize off the Duggar celebrity. Also Super Twunt is besties with the Jing. Nothing particularly FU internetz here.

I just watched the new one. 3 mins long and seems to be filmed at the TTH (screaming children and shoddy piano playing near the end). It's about salvation and Jesus's baptism. Ughh. :shhh:

Bin, I might respect you more if you could at least spew this nonsense compellingly and charismatically. You just sound too awkward and nervous. Don't get me wrong though. He is better than Priscilla....

[artdecades]

This post has inspired me. Next time someone tries this with me, I am doing this:

[bBvideo 560,340:3hm2adtd]

[/bBvideo]