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Bates Courtship


singsingsing

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I'm very new to FJ, but just had to post that I think Chad actually is 25. His parents apparently celebrated their 26th wedding anniversary in 2010 (see 12paines.com/2010/08/02/itc-conference/ ) so I think the time stamp on his presentation page is probably just not updated.

Hope I got things right now... :oops:

I actually argued at the time that I thought the page had been edited last summer, but I forget the argument I had as to why I thought that.

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I doubt that Erin and Chad will escape the fundie lifestyle, but I do think they'll be more evenly matched than the typical dominant headship, submissive helpmeet relationship. Erin is obviously pretty strong-willed and independent so I would imagine they'll be a bit more equal in their marriage.

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long time lurker, first time poster. so incredibly thrilled that my first post is on a bates courtship that FJ totally nailed!

and to echo what (most) other people have said, it does seem like there is some real chemisty between the two of them, not to mention they are just both too cute, so i am supportive! :dance:

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I doubt that Erin and Chad will escape the fundie lifestyle, but I do think they'll be more evenly matched than the typical dominant headship, submissive helpmeet relationship. Erin is obviously pretty strong-willed and independent so I would imagine they'll be a bit more equal in their marriage.

I've known a lot of people in the ATI/Gothard/fundy movement, and unfortunately many of the seemingly strong-minded, capable women become completely different characters after their godly marriage. It's sad.

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^^^I really hope not. I would never wish ill on anyone, even fundies.

On Chad's age, taken from comments in 2011:

12paines.com/about/our-home/

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Sorry, I don't find any of this cute. It's a fundie couple who were pushed together by their parents and probably barely know each other.

Yep, I agree with you. Just because they're attractive doesn't mean they won't beat the shit out of their future children, hate gays and feminists, etc. I think John Maxwell is cute but that doesn't mean I want to see him married, because I'm firmly convinced that he'll treat any future wife or children like absolute garbage. Pretty people aren't any more or less prone to evil behavior than ugly people.

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That is so likely that I feel a little sick now........

That visual made my gorge rise. Please pass the brain bleach. :puke-front:

fauxmenono (sp?): I knew I saw proof that Chad was younger somewhere. Thanks for fishing that out.

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I wonder how Zach & Michaella are taking this. Zach with his failed courtship and Michaella overshadowed by her younger, more vibrant sister courting/marrying while she's put out to pasture. (or the laundry room, as the case may be.)

Michaella in particular interests me. On the one hand, she seems like she's trying to rework her image lately with hair/dress more like her sisters, and I think she's lost a bit of weight too. I wonder if she's trying to improve her "countenance" in hopes that fundie guys will start to notice her before permanent spinsterhood sets in. On the other hand, though, she still seems like she's always hiding behind a baby, on the fringe of even her own family. I hope she's not as miserable as she always seems to me.

For those interested, I found some Bates pics here: https://www.facebook.com/allen.griffis# ... 698&type=1

There are some nice ones of Michaella.

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Judging by their pictures I think they have been courting for a while (by fundie standards). At least since summer as there are a few pictures of them walking around a field in just short sleeves and a skirt. Most of their together pictures still have leaves on the trees. The latest leaves fall in the mountains is early November. I tried to date the pictures but their camera either doesn't record the data or someone stripped them of it. I have to say though they really do look happy and if its truely what they want then bravo. I'd much rather see a girl get a choice in her husband even if its fundie than the awkward hardly spoken to each other pictures of the maxwell's courtship.

ANYWHO.... on a rant.. what is it with these fundies being able to afford the top of the top cameras. From this post... chadsperspective.blogspot.com/2012/06/tennessee.html hes got at least 2-3k worth of photo gear if it was bought used/an older version. I'm not a canon gal and can't tell which version it is. Makes me extremely jealous that I work but butt off and only have an upper entry level camera as I have student loans to pay down and can't buy the top of the line one I want. :evil:

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I never got the impression that Erin was particularly strong willed.

Able to boss around her younger sisters and bully her older sister into taking on her share of childcare and cooking doesn't really equal strong willed to me.

So long as Erin loves her headship (which she seems to) I can see her being very submissive and compliant. She seems to revel in showcasing what a young Gothard girl should be - pretty curls, immaculate makeup, staying at home teaching music (as a hobby more than a job) and even performing on a few CDs while she waits for her prince...... The fact that she manages to get out of the less glamorous duties of a SAHD really doesn't indicate any level of strength when you look at the whole picture.

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Well, I wish them all the best. They look relatively comfortable in those pictures, so let's hope that's a good sign and they're happy together, even if it's in their messed-up, fundie way.

I don't think this age difference is bad at all. Maybe it's a cultural difference, but when I was 17-18, loads of my friends were dating guys in their mid-twenties or so. One girl I know started dating a guy twelve years older than her at sixteen and they're still together eight years later. As long as everyone involved is legal (sixteen is the age of consent where I'm from), I think a ten-year age difference isn't a big deal. If he'd been fifty, that would've been odd.

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There IS no real age difference. She's 22, he's 25/6. That's about the same age difference between my husband and me. And in their isolated world, even a larger age difference, ie. Rachel Wissman and the guy she married (Alan?) who was 39/40 at the time, doesn't seem to be much of an issue.

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I guess I'm weird. I like Erin's hair.

I always thought her hair would be great for prom or a wedding.

Maybe her hair was the only way she could stand out and snag herself a man? Would explain why she just simply ties it back when her boyfriend is around.

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long time lurker, first time poster. so incredibly thrilled that my first post is on a bates courtship that FJ totally nailed!

and to echo what (most) other people have said, it does seem like there is some real chemisty between the two of them, not to mention they are just both too cute, so i am supportive! :dance:

Aint they though? Welcome! :)

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I think that a lot of them are complete fakes....doll parts and movie makeup, it wouldn't be hard, I could probably do it myself.

It sucks to be manipulated. Jerkoffs.

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If fundie guys are expected to own their own homes debt-free and be able to support a wife/family independently before they marry, and a woman is considered ideally marriagable from 18 to her early 20s, then age differences are probably quite large on a regular basis. And 3-4 years is nothing, even in your 20s.

That said, no matter how cute or into each other they seem, the dynamics of fundie marriage are inherently unhealthy. And as others have noted, their children will grow up hearing (and eventually spouting) the sexist, homophobic, abusive opinions that are the cornerstone of their belief system.

So the best I can muster up for this (or any) fundie matchup is something along the lines of :|

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I am also happy there seems to be chemistry between them and he comes off like he really likes her. I thought it was cute that he called her "my forever friend". If you have to be a married fundy that's probably the best case scenario.

His post gives me a little hope. If he is genuine and cares about her that much, maybe it would lead them to being fundy light or just having a less patriarchal dynamic in their marriage? If he really thinks about her as a friend he might value her opinion and feelings, sure he might be the official "head of house" but behind the scenes maybe they will talk things through. They might not even realize most fundy wives might not get that oppurtunity, you know? I just have a little hope that if their marriage is truly built on friendship they might have hope for naturally developing a more healthy relationship dynamic.

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I hope that their feelings for each other are genuine and go the distance.

I can't help thinking that they are just intoxicated by their first taste of love and the first relationship with the other gender they have ever been allowed.

Erin is the centre of attention, planning the wedding she's been taught to look forward to since birth, infatuated and flirting for the first time ever, about to finally be considered a grown up, sex is finally in sight...... They've both played by the rules and are about to get their rewards.

This is the easy fun part.i just hope their feelings remain and strengthen and deepen when the infatuation and novelty wear off and the realities of a patriarchal quiverfull marriage set in.

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I hope that their feelings for each other are genuine and go the distance.

I can't help thinking that they are just intoxicated by their first taste of love and the first relationship with the other gender they have ever been allowed.

Erin is the centre of attention, planning the wedding she's been taught to look forward to since birth, infatuated and flirting for the first time ever, about to finally be considered a grown up, sex is finally in sight...... They've both played by the rules and are about to get their rewards.

This is the easy fun part.i just hope their feelings remain and strengthen and deepen when the infatuation and novelty wear off and the realities of a patriarchal quiverfull marriage set in.

I do hope we'll see the bridal registries.

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I am also happy there seems to be chemistry between them and he comes off like he really likes her. I thought it was cute that he called her "my forever friend". If you have to be a married fundy that's probably the best case scenario.

His post gives me a little hope. If he is genuine and cares about her that much, maybe it would lead them to being fundy light or just having a less patriarchal dynamic in their marriage? If he really thinks about her as a friend he might value her opinion and feelings, sure he might be the official "head of house" but behind the scenes maybe they will talk things through. They might not even realize most fundy wives might not get that oppurtunity, you know? I just have a little hope that if their marriage is truly built on friendship they might have hope for naturally developing a more healthy relationship dynamic.

Sadly, given their backgrounds and lack of exposure to other lifestyles, I see his live for her being expressed as him wanting to own her and keep her close to him alone. And I see her love for him being expressed as complete submission and the patented ATI "worshipful stare at headship".

I hope it turns out otherwise for them, but I doubt it.

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It blows my mind that you can register for grocery items, but since Josh registered for junk food, I wonder if Erin will register for hair care products?

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If fundie guys are expected to own their own homes debt-free and be able to support a wife/family independently before they marry, and a woman is considered ideally marriagable from 18 to her early 20s, then age differences are probably quite large on a regular basis. And 3-4 years is nothing, even in your 20s.

That said, no matter how cute or into each other they seem, the dynamics of fundie marriage are inherently unhealthy. And as others have noted, their children will grow up hearing (and eventually spouting) the sexist, homophobic, abusive opinions that are the cornerstone of their belief system.

So the best I can muster up for this (or any) fundie matchup is something along the lines of :|

A girl like Erin is going to be married no matter what (in my old evangelical Baptist church, she would have been engaged by 19, the guys would have been drooping over her!), and the same for Chad....so I would rather see them married to someone that they are legitimately attracted too and enjoy being around then someone that Daddy finds and they only see each other twice before the wedding. The Bates and Paines have been friends for a few years, so there has been more exposure than with normal fundie relationships.

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Josh seriously registered for junk food???

You can register for ANYTHING at Target or Wal-Mart. Life in a Shoe's oldest daughter registered for Nutella and Sharpies. I registered for tequila on my Target baby registry. ;)

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