Hoarders

[lizzy]

Does anybody remember the guy that hoarded rats?!?!?! When he would throw food out onto the floor and hundreds would come flooding out, the sound just sends chills up my spine.

[ilovetchotchkes]

Does anybody remember the guy that hoarded rats?!?!?! When he would throw food out onto the floor and hundreds would come flooding out, the sound just sends chills up my spine.

My husband walked into the room when I was watching it, blanched and then said "zomg! Its Willard!"

[Shirley MacLaine]

Bumping to say... my friends made me watch this show with them over Thanksgiving, and now I'm hooked. It has finally given me the motivation to top-to-bottom clean my apartment, haha. I'm not a hoarder, but this show makes me want to not be messy. At all, ever!

ETA: For instance, I got an early Christmas present today from my parents... some pots and pans that came in a big cardboard box with lots of packaging. Ordinarily, I'd put everything back in the box and let it sit in the kitchen until I felt like moving it out to the recycling. BUT NOW I WILL TAKE IT IMMEDIATELY.

[Knight of Ni]

My grandmother is a hoarder. When she lived by herself she never threw anything out. There was 10 year old junk mail in her trailer home that she refused to throw out. Whenever she would see items on sale she would buy many times more than she actually needed. She bought enough Christmas paper plates that my family of five is still using 3 years later and she had at least 10 pairs of the same type shoe still in boxes. We finally had to move her out of the trailer to live with my aunt because she stopped paying her bills and her electricity was about to be cut off in the middle of winter. When we were cleaning out her trailer the floor had started to cave in because of the weight of so much stuff and minor water damage. She resents us for moving her out and I still don't think she's forgiven us.

Seeing how she used to live and this show has definitely encouraged me to fight my packrat tendencies. I don't want to end up like my grandmother.

[llv]

I'm a clutterbug, and I love all the hoarding shows (Hoarders, Buried Alive, etc.) Interestingly, they don't inspire me to clean. I just like to watch them. :lol:

[Constance Vigilance]

Hoarders is great for me because I grew up in a really messy house, and I have a tendency to stop seeing mess and clutter and just walk past it. When I start getting like that I just put on a few episodes and clean until it's better :D.

Most of the hoarders have serious mental illness, but there have been a couple where you could tell they just got lazy for a couple of weeks, then the mess was too overwhelming to get started, and it's just been piling up ever since. The thought that I might be in line for becoming one of them is great terror/motivation.

[Spider Burps]

My mother is a hoarder and I work with hoarders (Cue TV intro: "My name is Spider Burps. I'm a professional organizer specializing in compulsive hoarding and chronic disorganization.") and I can say that I have truly been in houses that are just as bad as the ones on the show. One of my clients actually recorded an episode that never aired because her "paths were too wide" quoth the TV execs! Needless to say, I watch Hoarders while attempting not to throw things at the screen.

I really disagree with the entire principle of giving someone with a serious disorder three days to (ideally) get rid of a majority of their stuff, completely ignoring the fact that most organizers only work with clients for four hours at a time MAX due to the mental breakdown that begins to occur--hence the breakdown scenes that are in every. single. episode. It's like they want them to happen! Add that to the fact that I use REBT instead of CBT (plus teaching time valuation) with my clients and I end up grumpy that no one is (at least on screen) doing anything but cooing "I know it's hard, I know you're sad but you're really hurting everyone else!" all while doing things to deliberately rile them up.

Derp.

[Kaylee]

I really disagree with the entire principle of giving someone with a serious disorder three days to (ideally) get rid of a majority of their stuff, completely ignoring the fact that most organizers only work with clients for four hours at a time MAX due to the mental breakdown that begins to occur--hence the breakdown scenes that are in every. single. episode. It's like they want them to happen! Add that to the fact that I use REBT instead of CBT (plus teaching time valuation) with my clients and I end up grumpy that no one is (at least on screen) doing anything but cooing "I know it's hard, I know you're sad but you're really hurting everyone else!" all while doing things to deliberately rile them up.

This exactly. I worked with a woman a while back on another show who is now a producer for Hoarders, and wanted to check in to see if I'd be a candidate for it. Since my house is a whole lot neater now than it was then, I wasn't a candidate, but I definitely got the vibe that they wanted really extreme, and also nasty. She mentioned that she wasn't sure if I would have qualified anyway, even if the house was more cluttered, because I am picky about my kitchen, fridge, and bathrooms being clean, and not having rotted food, nastiness, or animal waste. They wouldn't have much of a viewing audience if it wasn't for the shock and emotional breakdown scenes, so I'm pretty sure they do things they know will provoke them. They also go out of their way to avoid any cleaner or less cluttered areas and highlight the worst.

To be fair, the really do give people more than 3 days to clean it - it's actually several weeks up to 2-3 months, but the long, slow, cleanup doesn't make for a good storyline, so it's filmed and presented as being much shorter. That's good for the people involved in the show, but not for people trying to overcome their own problems and then feeling even shittier because they can't get a ton of stuff done by themselves in a weekend. One thing I will give Hoarders props for is they do help pay for counseling and/or organizing help, so they give people a support system beyond just the length of the show.

[Witsec7]

After watching this show one time I realized my husband was a hoarder. Our home wasn't a mess, but he did need a whole barn to store stuff, which, almost four years later hasn't been organized. He moved things like boxes of old eyeglasses and belt buckles, literally tons of wood and fasteners he would never use. Now that I'm out of the house he's 'collecting' musical instruments, he can't play. In retrospect I recognized he had relationships with stuff/things and never with people.

[polabear]

I love watching Hoarders. It makes me clean too, and keeps me more in line. I have a pretty big fabric / yarn hoard - sure, its all neatly organized in boxes, but it takes up a big corner of the basement. I've stopped adding to the yarn hoard, and slowed waaaay down on the fabric. I might have to buy some fabric for a quilt my stepson wants, but I've stopped the "but, its on sale!" buying.

Matt Paxton, who is one of the cleaners on the show, has an awesome podcast called 5 Decisions Away. There is a lot of cussing, and they talk about more than hoarding. It's still really really cool. And, they usually post on the A&E boards after the broadcast.

[genericJname]

Oh I love that show. It sends my husband into a cleaning frenzy, which kinda drives me crazy.

[Patsy]

her "paths were too wide" quoth the TV execs!

You mean cleared paths between clutter? As in, the house wasn't shocking enough for the viewers?

I use REBT instead of CBT (plus teaching time valuation) with my clients and I end up grumpy that no one is (at least on screen) doing anything but cooing "I know it's hard, I know you're sad but you're really hurting everyone else!" all while doing things to deliberately rile them up.

I'd be curious to hear more about this. I looked up REBT on wikipedia but it didn't really help out that much.

[MamaJunebug]

You mean cleared paths between clutter? As in, the house wasn't shocking enough for the viewers?I'd be curious to hear more about this. I looked up REBT on wikipedia but it didn't really help out that much.

Yes, please, more info if you would?! I can barely watch the show because of (a) the misery and (b) the way the therapists don't really seem to challenge the people to get better - at least, that's how I see it going down.

[Spider Burps]

Yes, please, more info if you would?! I can barely watch the show because of (a) the misery and (b) the way the therapists don't really seem to challenge the people to get better - at least, that's how I see it going down.

RE: the paths, yes her home wasn't "shocking" enough. She lived, at the time, in a studio apartment which was full to the ceiling of boxes, clothes, bikes, shopping trolleys(??? never figured that one out), broken furniture, charred/water damaged art, etc. She also owned/owns a house in a very desirable neighborhood which was severely damaged in a fire--when the firemen couldn't get in to stop it. During my time with her she moved into a one bedroom apartment and was working towards repairing and moving into her house, but I never got to see it through because I moved to another state. :(

Going to say before I explain: all of my clients have been individuals who went through organizers like most people go through tissues. They were deemed treatment resistant, which to me means that the wrong treatment approach was used--which makes total sense, because the books on organizing are all Pollyanna and assume that hoarders have the capability to decide on their own what is and isn't worth keeping around. One would not expect someone with OCD to stop their compulsion because it's annoying/weird/unsightly to others, but that's what many organizers expect from hoarders. They're aware that what they're doing is weird and embarrassing (which is why so many hoarders have friends that never find out the extent of their disorder), but they're not comfortable with the anxiety that they must deal with in order to stop the behavior. I created my own approach based on my affinity for Albert Ellis and the clinical success of REBT in those labeled as "treatment resistant".

Obviously, a big part of Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy (REBT) is recognizing the irrationality of one's behaviors, actions, thoughts and beliefs. CBT therapists and organizers, both on TV and in the real world, will oftentimes shrug and say "Well, okay, fine, you go ahead and keep this, but it's gonna make us all sad and it'll make your life difficult. Do you want this cos you're sad? Let's hug it out" or "Do ya love it? Do ya need it? Does it make you money?! No? TRASH IT!!!!!!" I, however, will pry. I'm kind of mean, incredibly blunt but can also be painfully logical. I hate to admit it, but I often gently mock my clients to their faces just to make them SEE how "silly" they are being about something that is, as a whole, inconsequential to their lives. Eventually, I've been told, my constant "Why?"s become a part of their thought processes and they hear me questioning their compulsions and then MY voice turns into THEIR voice which in turn becomes a part of their subconscious mind.

To sum it up: A lof of organizers will say, at least once per client, "Welp, legally I have to get rid of this because it's moldy". That creates an atmosphere of Me vs. You, Good Guy vs. Bad Guy as it makes the client feel like a child who just got their blankie taken away because their parents decided they've outgrown it. That combined with the "Only handle an item once!" concept makes it seem like like an authority figure and a child. With REBT, I am able to build trust by making the client feel like they've made all of the decisions when, really, I was there the whole time telling them what to do by questioning their flawed motivations and illogical thoughts. I never touch their things unless they ask me to and the client can hold their stuff as often as they need to until they can decide on their own that they should get rid of it. It really makes me feel less like the clutter police and more like the voice of reason. ;)

I feel like I didn't explain that as well as I could've. Feel free to tell me if you have specific questions and/or I didn't address something you wanted to know.

[MamaJunebug]

"Spider"Burps! Can we talk some more?????!!!!! :)

You wrote,

the books on organizing are all Pollyanna and assume that hoarders have the capability to decide on their own what is and isn't worth keeping around. One would not expect someone with OCD to stop their compulsion because it's annoying/weird/unsightly to others, but that's what many organizers expect from hoarders

That's what I see Dr. Tonya Harding and the others on Hoarders and Buried Alive doing! How dumb is it???

See, I seem to have some native talent for helping people de-clutter. Having seen Hoarders I don't think I'd ever approach it professionally (I'd gag and retch and that'd be that!) but I've helped a couple of friends and the following sounds familiar:

... I, however, will pry. I'm kind of mean, incredibly blunt but can also be painfully logical. I hate to admit it, but I often gently mock my clients to their faces just to make them SEE how "silly" they are being about something that is, as a whole, inconsequential to their lives. Eventually, I've been told, my constant "Why?"s become a part of their thought processes and they hear me questioning their compulsions and then MY voice turns into THEIR voice which in turn becomes a part of their subconscious mind.

I so wish you and your clients were on the show, instead of the professionally compassionate-looking Dr. Tonya and the bemused Dr. Andy Rooney Wannabee!

[Spider Burps]

"Spider"Burps! Can we talk some more?????!!!!! :)

Of course :D I'm always happy to talk about anything, especially organizing--oh and horrible TV. Can't forget horrible TV. ;)

See, I seem to have some native talent for helping people de-clutter. Having seen Hoarders I don't think I'd ever approach it professionally (I'd gag and retch and that'd be that!)....

You really could organize professionally if you were interested in it! Most people just want their closets decluttered or need help with downsizing. Once I worked with a mother/daughter duo (at their respective houses) to help them sort out the clutter from their kitchen pre-renovation and then put everything back in an organized manner once the renovation was complete. That was super fun because I got to see before and afters of kitchens. :D Plus, being NAPO certified isn't important at all so you can try it out in your spare time. Assuming you wanted to, of course!

The only reason I end up in hoarded houses is because I chose to specialize in compulsive hoarding and chronic disorganization (and mostly work with low income individuals) due to a therapist friend of mine -begging- me to meet the area's need for a sliding scale professional organizer willing to work in "dangerous" environments. Am considering writing a book about my own style of organizing, but I feel like either of the shows would tank -fast- if I ended up on there! No one wants to see someone rationalizing every. single. item., no matter how amazing the befores and afters are.

[MamaJunebug]

spidey, maybe not *every* item but heckfire, a good editor could put together some of the best experiences, intersperse those conversations with shots of the room getting cleaner ... and cleaner .... and cleaner!!

I'd watch it, I really would.

Christopher Lowell's (adore him!!!!!) book on decluttering was kind of the catalyst I needed on my own, late mother's nice collection of stuff (she was a pitch-er but still left quite a bit of stuff) and got me thinking, "I'm good at this." Have you looked at it? Busman's holiday, of course, but it has a few nice touches. CL has SUCH a heart for people.

Thank you immensely for encouraging me. I just might test the waters. I know the NAPO pro's around here charge upwards of $400 for a three-hour session. I'd be happy to get $20 or $25/hour.

[Spider Burps]

My mom was a huuuuge fan of the Christopher Lowell Show! I haven't read or even heard of his book and my library doesn't have it... Buuut I see that I can get it on Amazon for dirt cheap, so I'm going to throw it in my basket when I make my big holiday order tomorrow. Thanks for the recommendation. I'm always a fan of reading organizing books and I have a plane trip with a layover coming up next week--and then again the week after, so it's the perfect time to get a new one. At least that's what I'm telling myself. :)

$400 for a three hour session is industry standard, unfortunately, and NAPO officially doesn't allow for sliding scale fees, so I was discouraged from joining by several of the therapists I was getting clients from. When I lived in the DC metro area, my low income (think: public housing and on SSD) clients paid me $20 an hour plus a flat $10 for transport costs if I had to drive. My "regular" clients paid me anywhere from $50 to $100 per hour, with no transport fee, depending on their income. If you charged $25 an hour you'd be beating clients back with sticks!

Seriously, I'd be happy to help you out if you decide to try organizing and find that you have questions, need ideas or get stuck (or whatever!). I'm not very conventional, but I have a 100% success rate so far! *knocks wood*

[Kishiria]

Did anyone see last night's season premiere? One of the women featured, Annie, was ironically a house cleaner for a living. What was striking was that her hoard was based off the fact that she had 7 children, and all her energy was spent chasing after them and being pregnant. 7 is not quite the herd the QF crowd aspires to, but I thought that that was interesting. She was also the one who, after the house cleaners/organizers found her lost wedding ring, was not only able but happy to have the rest of her place cleaned out.